Canelo and his legacy as a LMW

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by lufcrazy, Nov 7, 2021.

Canelo as a LMW

  1. ATG top 5

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  2. ATG top 10

    5 vote(s)
    45.5%
  3. Outside of ATG top 10

    6 vote(s)
    54.5%
  1. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Obviously last night Canelo built upon his SMW legacy and furthered his credentials etc, however I'd like to discuss the 6 year period of his career from 2011 to 2017. His time as a LMW sized fighter.

    We have these victories at 154 or below: Baldomir, NDou, Hatton, Rhodes, Cintron, Mosley, Lopez, Trout, Smith. Over time this saw him collect the WBC, WBA and WBO titles. Beating Trout made him the divisional champion as well.

    We have a very comprehensive defeat to Mayweather at 154 also.

    But then we have a litany of fights at 155 pounds: Angulo, Lara, Kirkland, Cotto and Khan.

    Has he done enough to remembered as a great LMW? Historically it isn't the deepest division by any stretch.

    It was abandoned by by Griffith, was treated as a stop gap by Benvenuti, then the belts split and it didn't have a meaningful champion until Hearns made his mark. We then had powerhouses such as McCallum and Norris.

    The division then reveived a bit of attention when the likes of Trinidad, Hoya, Mosley and Vargas were all duking it out before Wright ended up being the last man standing.

    Mayweather and Cotto dabbled there for a bit to add to their legacy, but never made a lasting legacy.

    And then we have Canelo.

    So where does his face fit in the history of the LMW division? I've added a poll.
     
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  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    For me it comes down to those 155 pound fights, the ones that don't seem to currently improve his legacy in any division.

    Without those I'd say he's top ten borderline. But if we are going to add the 155 pound fights in, it would definitely increase his standing.
     
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  3. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist Full Member

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    The 155 fights are jr Middle fights in mind except for Cotto. It's not exactly a line up of natural 160s.
     
  4. AwardedSteak863

    AwardedSteak863 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He had a vwry good career at 154 but I'm not putting him up there with McCallum,Hearns, Wright and Norris.

    He had a nice win last night against Plant but I really don't think Plant is anything special. I think Canelo would be beaten if it was 15 years ago and he would have to face Calzaghe and Kessler. I don't think he could handle Calzaghe's hand speed and Kessler unlike Plant had the power to make him think twice about just walking in.

    With all that said, he is a very good fighter that is fun to watch. I'll be interested to see if he moves up to 175 now. Outside of Benavidez there isn't much left at 168.
     
  5. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Yeah but we're trying to focus purely on his position as a LMW here mate.
     
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  6. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I think I'm starting to think of it like this tbh.
     
  7. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Just as a small point it was Benitez more than anyone who legitimised the division i think. Most thought he'd found his peak weight and many theorized that he might even beat Leonard at the weight after he schooled Duran.

    I think he could be in the second half of the ten, particularly if one is counting the 155 pound battles.
     
  8. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Yes Benitez of course, the victory over Duran was a big one.

    Canelo in terms of his run at 154, the more I think about it, is definitely below that which Wright had.

    A list of lesser names bulking up a resume, unifying the division and then quickly moving on.

    But Wright did it against a prime Shane Mosley and Canelo did it against a prime Austin Trout.

    Wright was ducked by Mayweather and Canelo was schooled by Mayweather.

    Both moved up to MW with a similar degree of success.

    It's what Canelo has done since the victory over Golovkin that made him great, in terms of LMW run, I'd probably argue he is top ten, but only due to the shallow nature of the divisions history.
     
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  9. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Sound points. Bottom of the 10 sounds right and indeed it is s shallow division on the whole. I reckon you have nailed it personally.
     
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  10. Jpreisser

    Jpreisser Active Member Full Member

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    154 is one of those classes that deserves to be written off. It's a useless addition, like most junior/super classes that have thinned out the traditional divisions. Given that, it all depends on how you look at some of those over-the-weight bouts for Alvarez. Had he fought Lara at the limit he would have been the Junior Middleweight Champion of the World and that's a very good win historically, seeing as Lara is one of the greater 154-pound operators. If you count most of those over-the-weight bouts, minus the Cotto and Khan contests, I think you could reasonably place him inside the top-5 and at least inside the top-10.

    In regard to Lara, I think you could make the case that he is greater than Alvarez at 154. He arguably beat Canelo and then Castano at 35, the latter of which most people felt defeated Charlo in a Linear Championship bout. He beat Trout more comprehensively than Alvarez (not so with Angulo, however) did. And then you compare guys like Martirosyan, Williams, Smith, Gausha, etc., against Alvarez's Cintron, Smith, Mosley, Rhodes, etc., and include that Lara dedicated more time at the weight and I could see it how it fares favorably.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2021
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