Canelo Bivol rounds 1-4 - "close fight" comprehensively debunked debunked

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Quina74, May 10, 2022.

  1. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Look at the title of this topic. You came in here setting out to disprove the idea that rounds 1-4 were close or Canelo rounds, and you've failed miserably. The reddit comments and poll speak volumes and have completely destroyed your argument. The fans are split on rounds 1-4 because those were close, tough to score rounds. Tough to score because Canelo landed those great uppercuts, and blocked most of Bivol's shots.
     
  2. Quina74

    Quina74 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You seem to not understand things and repeat the same things over and over again. Then I give you the same response. There's genuinely something wrong with you.

    And no, I came on here went round by round timestamped punches and outlined in detail exactly why, although rounds 2 and 3 were competitive, Canelo has a very very poor case for them, and zero case for round 1. You on the other hand meaninglessly appeal to 20 or so redditors with 1 or 2 upvotes as if it was meaningful when I can find the exact same on the same platform in favour of what I'm saying. Again I've seen countless amount of people saying Bivol won 10, 11, 12 rounds. You heavily suggest that you agree with the judges and at one point explicitly stated you gave 5 rounds to Canelo.

    You also call DAZN commentators anti Canelo which is not only ridicuoous but wrong as there are occasions they call Canelo's punches which don't land.. You also appealed to compubox at one point but then backtracked when I proved Bivol was not credited for a good portion of his punches in round 2 and 3.


    You are an idiot of massive proportions and it's a thorough waste of time engaging in any meaningful debate with you as it pertains with Canelo, and in fact, anything else as it has shown that not only can you not be reasoned with but that you're dishonest.
     
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  3. ellerbe

    ellerbe I have spoken Full Member

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    Shadow you have to be a lawyer in real life :nut:. My guy compiled Reddit screenshots. :laser-kill:
     
  4. lordlosh

    lordlosh Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Long time ago i stopped arguing with people that have zero common sense and are beyond biased and are fanatics. I started ignoring them, and my time here is way better, you are also saving tons of time.
     
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  5. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    849 fans scored the fight in the poll you posted. About 40% of them scored Round 1 to Canelo, so that's about 340 fans. So it's a lot more than just 20 redditors who thought Canelo won rounds 1-4. It's about half of the 849 fans who voted in that poll.
    That may be so, but many of those people are Canelo haters who score every round against him no matter what happened. It's not about how many rounds you scored to Bivol, it's how many rounds you think can be scored to Canelo, and you have made it very clear that you do not think you can score 1-3 for Canelo. Maybe you'll feel differently about round 4, but 1-3 you have taken a very hard line stance that those rounds are not debatable.
     
  6. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I rewatched the 1st round through overhead camera angle in this video :



    That's a good camera angle to score the match from, no biased commentary distracting you while watching it, it gives you better angles Q of many of the shots that you were unsure about, including a good jab by Bivol that you were unsure about - you can see that better here. I went through the last minute of your timestamps of this round and made some corrections, added some punches and put in timestamps from this video in parentheses to go with your time left in the round timestamps.

    Watched the round normally at full speed, then went through the last minute at 0.25 speed to address the last minute of your timestamps and added more punches or blocks for reference. Bivol was busier in this round but was having difficultly landing clean, most of his punches were blocked. Some punches were blocked but still landed on the follow through, this goes for both fighters, the sort of blocked but still landed shots that we saw a lot of. Canelo landed the harder shots in this round and really roughed up Bivol on the ropes towards the end. Bivol hit mostly gloves aside from the occasional clean shot. The problem for Bivol was he was being outclassed by Canelo in this round. He was sent back to the ropes for a good portion of this round. Canelo was in boss mode this round and it's very difficult to score this round to Bivol with all the blocked jabs and his inability to land clean with Canelo landing and finishing the round strong.
    Watch the round from this camera angle, Canelo landed 2 power shoulder shots there that you wouldn't have counted thinking it hit arm or bicep, from in this camera angle you can see they hit the shoulder. There was a looping right hook with 0:15 left in the round with Bivol on the ropes, that moved him right into another jab. That was a good combo there with Bivol along the ropes. It's important that we talk about how often that Bivol was against the ropes and covering up and how often Canelo connected with hard power shots. In a round with Canelo blocking so well and not being hit clean, using effective aggression to back Bivol into the ropes multiple times and roughing him up, being the ring general. Canelo sealed the round by the end sequence with Bivol covering up on the ropes then with the uppercut at the end landing flush to end the round.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2022
  7. Quina74

    Quina74 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    All a load of nonsense crediting Canelo for doing f all... Yet again, no surprises there.

    I watched the first two timestamps you provided and I'm gonna stop there. You are appearing to credit Canelo for a jab then a right hook to the shoulder at 6:56. That is honestly ridiculous, nothing lands and certainly nothing with any meaningful impact. Then your second time stamp sounds like youre crediting Canelo as if the jab lands to the side of the head. Lmao. I'm not doing this again Shadow. You're doing the same thing as before. You cannot be unbiased. Surely you have the self awareness to recognise what you are doing? I'm out, you're no longer getting any of my time
     
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  8. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    End of Round 1

    0:16-0:14 Jab, Right Hook, Jab combo

    This content is protected
     
  9. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I addressed all your timestamps of the last minute and filled in the gaps. We have the advantage of the overhead camera angle we are not reliant on DAZN and their camera angles, now there are no excuses to not score this correct. We didn't have that in the Canelo GGG fights of another camera angle. In this fight we can see punches clearer from a better angle so there's no excuses this time.
     
  10. Quina74

    Quina74 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Shadow man, come on just drop it. None of that landed. The last unextended jab may have scrapped Bivols face.

    This is my last post on that thread, I will say this as my final statement. I scored it 12-0, 11-1. I could deal with 9-3 (rounds 4, 9 and one of the rounds (either 2 or 3 can't remember ) to Canelo). I can't see 7-5 Bivol I'm afraid. I have my way of scoring punches, you have your way, let's leave it that.
     
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  11. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    We heard about the idea that Canelo was landing arm punches which wouldn't have counted towards the scoring. These shoulder shots would have been noticed by the judges while Compubox wouldn't count them as landed thinking they hit arm and not shoulder. We can see how these landed from the overhead camera which were effective shots as Bivol was pinned on the ropes and had nowhere to go.

    I would like to hear the counter arguments for why Bivol won this round. A lot of fans have scored this for Bivol but why? Only the occasional clean shot, jabs hitting gloves, was roughed up against the ropes, with Canelo walking him down most of the round.

    Effective Aggression - Canelo, Clean Effective Punching = Canelo, Ring Generalship - Canelo, Defense = Both were blocking well in this round but Canelo was blocking more shots than Bivol. If Defense is a wash that round that's 1 drawn category and the other 3 scoring categories won by Canelo. If you disagree with this, then which categories did Bivol win in Round 1 and why. It would be difficult to argue Bivol won Effective Aggression or Ring Generalship that round, Canelo was walking him down most of the round, landing the harder shots, pinning him against the ropes.
     
  12. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Did you see the flick of the right hook? Landed around the guard to the side of head and moved Bivol to the right into the jab. Bivol was being held up by the ropes.
    He timed it perfectly it flung into Bivol's face as he was moving right from the hook. It was 3 punch combo.
    Your final statement? I thought you wanted to go through this.
     
  13. FrankinDallas

    FrankinDallas Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I don't know who you are responding to as apparently I have him/her/they on ignore.
    However saying DAZN employees are anti Canelo is right up there with Russian propaganda on Ukraine. I like AK and Barack, but I would not be surprised if Canelo has sodomized both of them.
    Same goes for Mannix and Mora.
     
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  14. Jackman65

    Jackman65 Dat bicep doe. Full Member

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    This thread is hilarious. Can’t believe something so convincing would warrant so many posts but this is a Canelo thread. The overhead view is a great way to see what actually happened but it’s a little different than what the judges saw from their angle.

    I had these rounds 4-0 for Bivol but if you try, you can give one round to Canelo. The fact that all three judges gave these rounds to Canelo, unanimously is all you need to know about the level of corruption that surrounds Canelo. It’s disgusting.

    If Canelo gives Bivol the rematch he promised, they should have open scoring and announce scores after each round. It’s not a perfect solution but it’s better than the current way of scoring. Shine a little light on the scum judges who are part of the corruption problem in boxing. Think about it, all three judges had the first FOUR rounds unanimously for Canelo and you have to try hard to give him one round. Boxing is rotten and house fighters like Canelo are the beneficiaries of this corruption.
     
  15. ConfusedGuy

    ConfusedGuy Member Full Member

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    the fans aren't split on the first 3 rounds.....in all the polls Bivol won those 3.