'Canelo had an off night'

Canelo is simply not on Bivols level, he never was. I tried to tell the Canelo fans that Plant and Saunders were not of Bivols caliber.

He's a good fighter, and he'll dominate 160 and 168 quite comfortably, but he's severely outclassed in almost every catagory against demi god dimitry and he's at a stylistcal disadvantage as well. He cannot beat Bivol under any circumstances, except by war crime robbery. The scorecards so atrocious that the judges would be sent to the penitentiary for life

 

There is no way "face of boxing" would lose like Canelo lost.

 

Bellew is a company man and a gobshite I thought this was a pretty well known fact?

 

Canelo will have another off night if he meets Bivol again.

 

I dont think it was an off night at all, he just fought a bigger and highly skilled fighter that didnt "Come to spar" like some idiot on here said was going to happen. Imo and im a huge Canelo fan, leave Bivol alone and defend your crown at 168. Canelo cant beat Bivol.

 

According to Canelo himself he won the fight.
It was the judges who were against him.

 

Blind man could see he didnt win that fight....wasnt even close

 

Tell that to Canelo and his most rabid fans.

 

I agree with all with what you said apart from this.

He got 8-4d by a 36 year old GGG twice. He won 7-5 (there's a case for 6-6, there were many who had it a draw) against drained Jacobs - a guy who then went onto look stale against Rosado (and get a gift).

Canelo at 168, as I've explained in a previous post, is all smokes and mirrors. Let say these 168 fighters came to win (they didn't, apart from BJS imo).

Smith - looked poor after he robbed Ryder, Best W was a one armed shoulder Groves at the end of his career. Looked mediocre against a kickboxer. If this context wasn't enough he was given 4-5 week camp (struggled finding sparring partners) for the biggest fight of his career.

BJS - natural 160lber. Hadn't fought world level in 3 years since Lemieux. Was essentially gifted a belt at stevenage by Shefat Isufi. Had looked pretty much meh in all his outings at 168lbs. Looked subpar against aged shot Murray after having layoff. BJS made it clear he needed more fights before fighting Canelo after Murray. Still went ahead and fought Canelo. Historically Billy has had on/off performances. When he was supposedly at his best, he looked poor (in the Akavov and Ryder fights at least) and had very close fights with Akavov, Ryder (both arguable lost), Andy Lee and even Chris Eubank. Despite all this valid important context, Billy managed to nick 4-5 rounds off the so called face of boxing in Canelo (many had Billy winning 5, even DAZN commentator Chris Mannix).

Plant - discount Mayweather who isn't as slick as everyone makes him out to be. Many had him up or at least nip and tuck WITH Canelo on their scorecards. Plant has beaten really nobody of note (apart from Uzvategui a few years back) and although won clearly against Truax, looked mediocre to say the least.

The idea that Canelo beats everyone at 160-168 comfortably is just flat out wrong

 

GGG is 40 now and the best guy at 160, so who at middleweight beats Canelo now, because at his state, he's not even going to get a chance to get jobbed on the cards, he's probably getting dominated by Canelo. He's old and Canelo is even better than he was at middleweight

How did Plant not come to win ? Plant literally gave it his all, he was trying to use the Philly shell and the jab to outbox Canelo and indeed he gave Canelo a hard night. Plant is mediocre yes but so is everyone else and my point still stands. Nobody at super middleweight is beating Canelo

Alright Quina, who beats Canelo at 160 and 168 ? Jacobs is past it who Canelo already beat, Canelo already got rid of Smith, Plant, Saunders, Charlo is decent at best and GGG is a fossil. Nobody at 160 or 168 currently beats Canelo.

The probability is no one at 160 or 168 is beating Canelo, because they're all mediocre except old fossil GGG and maybe Benavidez ? John Ryder and Benavidez have the best chance, but Ryder gets KO'd as he looked average against a past it Jacobs and Benavidez is nothing special. Not a mover and likes to brawl. Not good against Canelo

 

Dude, my argument is that Canelo does not beat everyone comfortably for my aforementioned reasons which I don't feel like repeating again.

Canelo is not better at 168 than 160 that's just false. Again, read my smoke and mirrors talk of Canelo cleaning out the 168 division, deckstacked opportune cherrypicks. Despite this, he still had very close fights with BJS and Plant.

Canelo has declined since GGG 1&2. He plods forwards, minimal head movement, throwing looping telegraphed haymaker to arms, elbows and shoulders. He has not improved since GGG 2, that's just false.

GGG won twice 8-4 at 36. What makes you think he can't pull it off? Yeah he looked slower against Murata but you've got to remember he's had a long lay off. Despite this, GGG pummeled and broke down a gold medalist in brutal fashion. Murata is a big middleweight and he hits very hard. Some of his body shots look more vicious and hard hitting than Canelo's. GGG took them and put some serious hurt on Murata.

Canelo is coming off a loss and will have a lack of morale going into a third fight with GGG who is intelligent experienced fighter who may be able to take something from Bivol as a template to help beat Canelo.

Your point still stands that Canelo beats everyone comfortably? Again I've proved that he didn't beat Plant or BJS comfortably, and these were cherrypicked cardstacked opponents. Smith was a card stacked opponent.

David Benavidez, if he came to win, would. He's a huge super middle weight, with fast combinations and fair volume. We have seen that Canelo gets bedazzled and just shells up when opponents throw fast combinations. Volume and speed is the key to beat Canelo with his judges.

And also, given what I have said about card stacked cherrypicked opponents giving Canelo a hard competitive time, many at middleweight would provide Canelo with a hard fight on even terms. Canelo would not win these fights comfortably so you claim:

Charlo - huge hard hitting 160lber. He has some pretty fast heavy counters. And he has something Canelo doesnt like a hard vicious jab. He would take the fight to Canelo and wouldn't be pitty pattering him. He would absolutely stand a good chance of beating Canelo. At the very least, Canelo wouldn't beat him comfortably so you claim.

Andrade - Canelo would not beat him comfortably. Yeah he looked like he got tagged by euro level Williams, but that was in the way Williams offers his pressure. Canelo isnt fast on the front foot like Williams is and doesn't bum rush and throw several punches in the process (which is how Williams tagged Andrade a two times). Andrade is rangy, tall, has good lateral movement, slicker than Plant imo, good jab, pretty fast hands, nasty uppecuts that can split that fiarly static guard of Canelo's.

To think he beats Andrade comfortably is just looking at Canelos 168 fights like he is some unbeatable god. Which I've explained, 168lbs is all smokes and mirrors.

Deryvanchenko - yes he is 35 or so. But Canelo has a trend of getting beat by 35-36 year old. Dervyanchenko has been robbed a few times actually, and is very good fighter with fairly extensive amateur pedigree.

He is a bad style match up even for Canelo. He has fast hands, unpredictable fast combinations, a hell of volume (you'd see Canelo gas in this fight), a chin, and very good lateral movement.

He's a much better and proven fighter than the Billy Joe Canelo fought, who won 4-5 rounds. That's not even debatable tbh.

I'm not saying these guys win, but Canell would have an uncomfortable time with them 100%..youve suggest Canelo would comfortably win seemingly based on his smoke and mirrors performances at 168

 

Keep this same energy when Canelo beats him clearly

Plant and Saunders were not cherrypicked they held titles you doofus and Canelo wanted to be undisputed at 168

Keep this same energy when Canelo beats him clearly

Charlo gets knocked out or gets hit with something big and then gets scared to let his hands go.

Okay so lets see here. Andrade, Deryvanchenko, and Charlo (lol).

So... my question was, who beats Canelo.... not who gives him trouble. Sure they can give him trouble, maybe he doesn't dominate comfortably, but they are not beating Canelo, not even in the sense that they'd get robbed on the cards.

Do not forget i am the one who told you Bivol will upset Canelo, and i have come to tell you NOBODY on your list will beat Canelo nor will they even have an argument on the cards

And TBH you see, the problem is that if Canelo were to beat Andrade convincingly to the boxing community and im very certain he would... you'd claim Andrade has beaten nobody and wouldn't give Canelo his credit.

If Canelo were to beat Charlo convincingly to the boxing community and im very certain he would.... you'd claim Charlo looked mediocre in his past few fights or Charlo "didn't come to win" and you wouldn't give Canelo any credit.

If Canelo were to beat Deryvanchenko convincingly to the boxing community and VERY certain he would, you'd claim Deryvanchenko lost to Charlo and Jacobs and looked mediocre against Adames, and you wouldn't give Canelo any credit.

You claim Benavidez can do it, but If Canelo beats Benavidez convincingly to the boxing community and im sure he will, you WILL claim Benavidez has no good wins, fought nobody, and was just an overrated mediocre.

you do this to ALL of Canelos wins. ALL of them, every single ones of them, either that or claim they didn't come to win, when in reality Canelo was just levels above them, minus that weird bout with Kovalev. You nitpick his record to oblivion. You can do that to any record.

 

Well he hardly dominated GGG at 160lb. so no I don't think he dominates either weight.
The belt holders at 168lb are the weakest that I can remember with no elite wins at the weight between any of them. The best win is probably Smith's win over a shot and injured Groves. Just let that sink in for a minute.