Canelo looks worried

I can't stand El Pollo.....................he refused to fight at 160lbs. for the 160 lb. title! El Pollo thinks he is above boxing. Hell, compare the fans at ringside with the number of fans for Joshua/Klitschko fight!

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...lovkin-potential-fight-must-be-at-catchweight

 

and let's not forget that when the fight took place, Cotto had been stripped of the WBC MW strap

so the WBC sanctioned a MW title fight in which

• neither fighter held the WBC MW strap; and

• neither figher was allowed to weigh in at the MW limit (155 catchweight)

 

Point #3
And that if Canelo won, all parties KNEW GGG would be his mandatory.

 

yep, in fact, GGG was Cotto's mandatory, which Cotto avoided by reaching an agreement with the WBC which allowed him to instead fight Canelo. Part of that agremeent was a step-aside payment to GGG, which Cotto later refused to pay.

 

First of all, Mayweather and Canelo money are both big money fights.

Compared to what Triple G has been making vs other fighters, the money he would make vs Canelo is in the same ballpark to what he would make vs Floyd.

That quote about having Triple G come down to 155 was from Oct 2015, that was before Canelo vs Cotto occurred, before Canelo was Middleweight Champ. At the time, no one seemed to have any problem with catchweights or Cotto defending that title at catchweights.

I found the full quote and apparently he went on to say "At this moment (Oct 2015) by body isn't ready for 160 pounds. Maybe 1 or 2 more years I'll be ready for 160, I don't know . . ."

Well 1 or 2 more years later from that quote, here we are, and Canelo is now ready for 160. (but not back then) He and Cotto then were considered Jr Middleweights, so the 155 made sense at that time. Canelo was simply saying "look I'm a Jr Middleweight" and that if Triple G wants to fight him let him come down to 155 like he did with Floyd at 152. It just points out how no one criticized Floyd for doing that type of thing to him, but when he suggested Triple G come down to 155, it was seen as blasphemy.

However, once he actually became Middleweight Champ, I don't see where he started demanding Triple G make 155. If he said that before he came Middleweight Champ, as a Jr Middleweight, I don't see what the problem is. At that point, Canelo saying that would be like Ward asking Dawson to come down from 175 to 168 to fight him, which happened didn't it. Once Canelo beat Cotto and became MW Champ though, then quotes like were used to make it seem like Canelo was still demanding Triple G make 155, which he wasn't.

 

And Cotto had defended that title at a catchweight in his previous fight vs Geale, and in the fight where he won the title vs Martinez which was also below the limit at a 159 catchweight. So that was the 3rd consecutive fight that the title was defended at a catchweight, and they all involved Cotto. So who's fault was that? Blame the WBC, Blame Cotto, but how do you blame Canelo for that? Canelo had nothing to do with those catchweights. He merely agreed to Cotto's demands.

 

Triple G was Cotto's mandatory, who then became Canelo's mandatory. But at the end of the day, neither Cotto or Canelo were seen as true Middleweights. They were both blown up Jr Middleweights, so the idea that either of them should have to fight at a weight they've never fought at before is inherently flawed.

That's where the confusion comes in, because you are first of all not criticizing Floyd (who had fought and won titles at 154 before) for demanding Canelo drop to an absurd 152 to have a unification fight, but then turning around and essentially mandating that Canelo fight Triple G in a division at a weight that he's never fought at before. Canelo got himself into this situation by fighting Cotto, which was the biggest fight out there for him aside from Floyd, but Floyd wouldn't give him a rematch.

You can't blame Canelo for taking the Cotto fight, it was the biggest fight out there for him. At the same time he shouldn't have been expected to fight at a weight that he's never fought at before. Canelo back in Oct 2015 was saying "look if ya'll want to see me fight Triple G so badly, then let him come to 155". (since again just two years prior he did that type of thing with Floyd)

It all comes back to Floyd vs Canelo at 152 to understand the double standards involved here. If you're going to hold Canelo's feet to the fire for this statement in Oct 2015, then to be consistent, you have to also hold Floyd to that same standard for needing Canelo to make 152 in 2013. The way I see it, had Floyd vs Canelo happened at 154 like it should have, or had Floyd given Canelo a rematch at 154, then all this catchweight stuff probably wouldn't have happened. But it did, so Canelo had no choice but to make the biggest fight out there with Cotto, a fight that the fans wanted to see. In doing so he got lumped into the whole Triple G saga, but again that's also a big fight that we want to see and he's never shyed away from making that fight. Before he became MW Champ, he said "let Triple G come to 155", not an unreasonable thing to say after what he's been through with Floyd and the fact that he's never fought at 160 and at that time wasn't a 160-lb champ. Once he became the MW champ though, rather than try to drain MWs he made the fight with Khan, then vacated, because he still considered himself a Jr Middleweight, and not ready to move up to 160. He wanted the one more fight at Jr Middleweight, then made it clear that he's move up to MW precisely when he said he would back in Oct 2015.

 

i never said or implied that i "blamed" Canelo for anything.

i certainly don't "blame" him for the situation here; in fact, he seems least blameworthy as between himself, WBC, and Cotto.

my posts aren't about Canelo but about the WBC's sanctioning of a MW title fight without a strap and at a required weight well below the MW limit

 

Please, you have to stop, if you have a title in a certain weight you should be able to defend the title in that weight. Doesn't matter if they are not "seen" as that heavy. If you you rather give up the title than defend it in the right weight, you shouldn't wasted everyone's time and fought for it in the first place.

It doesn't matter who started it and why people are doing it, it's still wrong!

 

I'm as against catchweights in title fights as you are, but this thread is about Canelo and it got side tracked as usual into the title situation at Middleweight involving catchweights and what not.

As much as we dislike catchweights, the fact of the matter is that Canelo won the Middleweight Title at a 155 catchweight, which was the highest weight he’d ever fought at. After winning the title at a catchweight, to then expect that he defend the title in a unification fight in his 1st defense of that title vs the top dog in that weight class at the full 160 is asking a lot of a guy who hadn't ever fought at that weight before. (which is what Canelo was being asked to do)

I agree that there was a problem with Canelo vs Cotto at 155 for the Middleweight Title. But at the same time, that was the best available fight for Canelo to take considering Floyd was unwilling to rematch Canelo for the 154-lb titles, so Canelo had no other big fight options at that time. He had already beaten the top fighters at 154, and Cotto was the biggest name out there for him to fight. It’s hard to call that fight a waste of time despite it being at a catchweight when that’s the fight that everyone was pressuring Canelo to take, that was the fight that the public wanted.

What the commissions should have done was actually enforce their rules and force Floyd to either defend his 154-lb titles or have him vacate those titles due to inactivity so that Canelo vs Cotto could have occurred at 154 for the vacant titles instead of at a MW catchweight. But as we all know, Floyd got special treatment to be allowed to hold those titles for 2 years while never defending them which was wrong, so there were no title opportunities for Canelo or Cotto at 154. So Canelo and Cotto made the most of a highly unusual situation, and made the fight at 155. As wrong as it felt to have that title contested at a catchweight, if it led to an eventual Canelo vs Triple G fight the feeling was that it would be worth it. And the feeling also was that since Canelo and Cotto were really Jr Middleweights, that the catchweight was fair to both fighters.

Compared to Cotto’s previous fight where he actually drained a real MW in Geale, well Canelo vs Cotto was at least better than that! (still wrong being at a catchweight, but still a very big PPV worthy fight between Canelo and Cotto)

Don’t get it twisted, I’m not justifying what happened, I’m explaining to you what happened and why it happened, and pointing out that Canelo was getting screwed by boxing politics in two divisions at the same time. After fighting Floyd to his closest fight in years, a Majority Decision, he should have been granted an automatic rematch for fighting Floyd that close. Instead the decision was universally mocked as being scored too close and Floyd was protected from having to fight Canelo at the full limit of that division. (something you should be outraged by based on your criticism of disliking catchweights in title fights) Then to make matters worse, Floyd somehow wasn’t even forced to ever defend those titles over 2 whole years until he actually retired but was allowed to remain Lineal and unified champion of that division that entire time while he returned to fight at welterweight. (something that no other fighter would be allowed to do)

What Canelo wanted was a rematch with Floyd. When it was clear that Floyd wouldn’t grant him one and was holding that division hostage, then Canelo reluctantly took the next best option which was Cotto at 155, and the rest is history. So to make a long story short, of course if you win a title at the limit of a division, you should be expected to defend it at that limit. However when you’re put into a catchweight title fight that the public is demanding you take, it’s ridiculous to then expect that fighter to defend that title at the limit of the division when he’s never even fought at that weight before. It was a highly unusual situation, and it’s now been sorted out with Canelo vacating the belt and finally getting a title shot at 154 vs Liam Smith. After that fight, he announced he's going to move up to campaign at MW, which is what he said he would do back in Oct 2015.

Canelo’s taken a lot of heat for all this, but in reality he’s made the best of a bad situation, and in the process he’s beaten some of the biggest names of the sport, and he’s won his last two fights in dramatic knockout fashion. What I’m doing is setting the record straight, you got posters here acting like Canelo is making a mockery of the sport, and he’s done nothing of the sort. If anything Cotto made a mockery of the sport based on what he did at Middleweight, but I'm not one to sit here and criticize Cotto because I respect what he's done in his career and I also realize that he's truly a Jr Middleweight and the fact that he competed at Middleweight even at catchweights is impressive for someone who most consider to be just a blown up welterweight. What Canelo has done is got the division back on track, in part by vacating the title that was being defended at catchweights and returning in his division for a title at the full 154 limit like he did in his last fight. As annoying as this catchweight stuff has been, if it results in what we want, which is Canelo vs Triple G (at 160) later this year, then it may just be worth it.

But lets not forget that none of this probably would have happened if Floyd Mayweather hadn’t been too scared to fight Canelo at the full 154, or hadn’t been scared of rematching Canelo. We could have had a Canelo vs Floyd Trilogy and Floyd could have some losses to Canelo on his record, but no we had to put up with this 152 BS then Floyd ducking Canelo, then Canelo being forced into a MW catchweight fight.

The good news is that now all that shenanigans are behind us, and we have a Super Fight on our hands with Canelo vs Chavez at 164, and possibly another Super Fight with Triple G on the horizon. I want to see nothing more than for the MW Division to get back on track, and for no more catchweights to occur in title fights in any weight division. But unfortunately you got posters still carrying on about how Canelo vacated the belt and we just keep going round and round in circles. That’s why we need to have Canelo fight Triple G for the MW Titles, and that can’t happen until Canelo fights Chavez. Hopefully this will all sort itself out and we won’t have to worry about catchweights any longer. Still, when it’s brought up, I’m going to continue to set the record straight as to what happened and who’s to blame, because frankly Canelo’s been blamed for stuff that other people did wrong or allowed to happen, and those people who did wrong are not being called out on it.

 

I always though catch weights fights were fine as long as no title was on the line and it helped make a fight that normally wouldn't have happen otherwise

 

Because he had the middle weight belt! Don't fight for the belt if you don't want to defend it at that weight!

 

Yes, and had I been born in a wealthy family I'd have never worked in my life, so what?

If... that If... that if.... that.

I'm not talking about "ifs", I'm talking about reality, and what happens is that this is the most important fight of their lifes for both of them. Whether you like it or not.