Cant for the life of me understand how Usyk not p4p #1

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by tinman, Sep 29, 2019.


  1. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    Listen Genius, Porter and Usyk didn't fight when Usyk was just taking up the sport. Usyk medaled in the European championships the year he lost to Porter.

    I fought in the Silver Gloves (ages 10 to age 15) when I was a kid. Silver Gloves are the tournaments for people who are too young to fight in the Golden Gloves. So I know what those tournaments are like. (Unlike you and your Taekwondo meets).

    Silver Gloves tournaments only have a handful of competitors. There are only a handful of actual tournaments a year. The matches are mild. And they may meet one or two kids. At most. They aren't ANYTHING REMOTELY like Golden Gloves tournaments

    ... Or the FREAKING EUROPEAN CHAMPIONSHIPS.

    You never fought in boxing tournaments when you were a kid. I DID. I KNOW MORE FIRST HAND ABOUT THIS than you do.

    So don't condescend to me. Seriously. I competed in those tournaments. THEY WEREN'T the European Championships.

    Usyk was bigger, stronger, and had more elite level experience than Porter did when Porter beat him.

    And anyone lumping Usyk and his accomplishments in with Loma is high.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2019
  2. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    And Szpilka was carried from the ring on a stretcher and rushed to the hospital. And he couldn't fight for a year. And whatever Wilder did to him with that shot all but ruined him.

    I can't wait for Wilder-Usyk.

    I can just picture it now ... (begin dream sequence)




    [media]zfC8vp7eODE[/media]
     
  3. Big Ukrainian

    Big Ukrainian Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Spilka's stamina is (and always was) a total sh!t. Usyk has probably the best stamina in boxing. If Szpilka had a desent stamina, he would continue to clown Wilder until the end of twelth round making him look like a clown even more times than he did.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2019
  4. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    Well, we'll see if Usyk has the best in stamina when he's fighting guys who outweigh him by 40 pounds. His days of pushing guys his size and smaller around are over.

    Wilder can still crack at the end of fights when those monsters drape themselves on him.

    Usyk's never had to deal with that.

    And we'll see if Usyk's got the best chin when the biggest puncher in the whole sport is cracking him.

    The "fantasy" aspect of Usyk's career is over.

    If he's the best in boxing, he'll have to prove it here. (And he drug his feet getting here.)

    Wilder WASTES Usyk.
     
  5. Dirsspaardis

    Dirsspaardis Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Then I’m even more baffled that you cannot grasp the idea that someone who boxed for 4 years can be inferior in experience to a guy who boxed for 15.
    It’s pretty simple.

    Although the level of ignorance (taekwondo meets) you display gives me a pretty good clue as to where the problem is.

    Entertain me -
    Usyk has had 16 pro fights now.
    Wilder has had 41 pro fights now.
    Who’s the more experienced of the two?

    Following your logic, it’s Usyk again, based on what he has accomplished during his 3x shorter run.
     
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  6. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    I know. It's baffling.

    When I watched Usyk as an amateur and a pro, and I watch his smooth boxing skills and his command of the ring

    ... and then I watched Shawn Porter's whole career, running head first into clinches, swinging wildly with lefts and rights, clumsily trying to punch on the inside while grabbing and mauling, depending on his sturdy chin to cover for all his defensive liabilities ...

    I NEVER thought ... IF ONLY Usyk had started boxing at 4, he could be as good, graceful, and as "experienced" as Shawn Porter.

    I must be the only one. (sarcasm again)

    Please. Usyk entered the legit amateur ranks 16-and-up before Porter did (because Usyk is nearly a year older).

    Usyk is much bigger. He is stronger. He's far more skilled. And the year he medaled at the European Championships, Usyk "somehow' managed to LOSE TO A FAT VERSION of the mauling Shawn Porter.

    I know that blows you guys' minds, so you have to try to paint Shawn Porter as something he wasn't ... like he was this all knowing, boxing zen master Yoda.

    But Usyk had no business losing to Porter. Usyk was fighting against grown men in international meets before Shawn Porter was even old enough to get invited.

    But it happened. Just accept it and move on.

    The only reason Porter's name was mentioned in this thread is people thought Spence should be rated lower than Usyk because Spence struggled with Porter. We were just pointing out Usyk couldn't even beat Porter when they fought.

    It doesn't matter now. Usyk's days of fighting Shawn Porter are over.

    Deontay Wilder isn't Shawn Porter.
     
  7. Dirsspaardis

    Dirsspaardis Well-Known Member Full Member

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    This is the most sense you’ve made so far.
    Experience doesn’t equal skill though so you’ve gone a full circle again.

    And you didn’t answer my question.
    Wilder or Usyk?
     
  8. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    Experience does not equal skill. I never said it did.

    But in the case of Usyk, he had more experience than Porter in actual amateur boxing and he's more skilled than Porter ever was.

    Yet he still got mauled and out-hustled and lost. It happens.

    It's not brain surgery.

    Arguing that Shawn Porter won because he was some boxing svengali who has been fighting since he was four and Usyk was this novice is a joke.

    Your experiences getting beat up by children in taekwondo class have nothing to do with this.

    I know you want to picture Usyk being as bad at fighting as you were when he fought Porter, but he wasn't.

    He medaled in the European championships the year he lost to Porter. He was a world-class amateur.

    Porter was a domestic champ, by comparison, when he moved up and started competing against adults in the amateurs.

    Except for the day a fat, overweight, short mauling Shawn Porter beat the smooth-boxing Usyk. (LOL)
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2019
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  9. Dirsspaardis

    Dirsspaardis Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Still no answer and the reason why you’re avoiding the question couldn’t be more obvious.


    I didn’t get beaten up in “my taekwondo” or kickboxing and I’m not trying to picture Usyk “as bad” as me. Although I’m nowhere near as skilled nor talented as him.
    Not only ignorant anymore, presumptious too :lol:
     
  10. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Youngest Ezzard Charles Fan Ever Full Member

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    You like completely ignored what he said
     
  11. Big Ukrainian

    Big Ukrainian Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Of course he isn't. Porter is on another level in terms of skills. Wilder has excellent height, reach and enormous power, but his skillset is beyond awful.
     
  12. Big Ukrainian

    Big Ukrainian Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Floyd Mayweather had no business getting his ass handed to him by glass-jawed B-level fighter Augie Sanchez, midget Martin Catillo and Bulgarian plumber Serafim Todorov in the amateurs. Answer me please, do those losses affect his historical standings at the pro ranks? Did they affect his P4P status in 2004-2016?
     
  13. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    Am I supposed to answer every dumb question someone poses? This isn't my thread.

    Who has more experience between Wilder and Usyk? Usyk had 10 times as many amateur fights. Wilder has had a lot more pro fights and is a dominant heavyweight champion. Usyk has had fewer pro fights but was a dominant cruiserweight champion.

    They're both experienced. Who has the "most" means nothing.

    Usyk would need to outpoint Wilder. Wilder would need to outslug Usyk.

    Like Usyk needed to outbox Porter, but didn't.
     
  14. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Boxing Junkie booted Full Member

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    Please answer me. Please. Please answer me. Go away. I don't give two craps about any pound-for-pound lists. Then or now.

    I just thought it was funny people were bashing Spence for not beating Porter more convincingly, and saying Usyk should be rated higher on the mythical list, when Usyk couldn't beat a fat Shawn Porter when he got in the ring with him. Like having a hard time with Shawn Porter disqualifies someone.

    But that off-hand comment seems to have sent you guys spiraling.

    The "make-believe" days of Usyk's career are over.

    If he wants to be the best boxer in the sport, he needs to become the top heavyweight in the world. If he can't, then he isn't the best boxer in the sport.

    You can't be the fifth best heavyweight and be the best fighter in the sport.

    Usyk will have to prove he's the best in the sport against the best heavyweights - like Wilder and Fury - who both have advantages over him.

    If he can't do it, then he isn't the best.

    Floyd Mayweather and Augie Sanchez have nothing to do with it.
     
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  15. Malph

    Malph Active Member Full Member

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    Usyk at heavyweight is completely unproven. He will be fighting at a decided disadvantage at heavyweight.

    Usyk is a very good and technically gifted boxer. He was clearly the best CW out there. At heavyweight though, I dont think that will be enough. The size and power of the top heavies will be a lot for him to overcome.

    I wish him well and it will fun to watch but hes got a huge challenge ahead.

    Holyfield pulled off moving up into the heavyweights. He was roided to the gills though. Perhaps thats the path forward for Usyk but I don't think he could get away with that unless he only fights in Europe. He doesnt not have the fan base or drawing power in the US to be afforded such luxury.

    So. My prediction is Usyk becomes a descent heavy but doesnt quite reach the top. Lack of size and power being his shortcomings. Think Chris Bryd and Povetkin. Both good boxers but generally coming up a little short when pitted against the best big men.
     


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