Carl Froch or David Haye P4P?

Has he beaten boxers more accomplished in their weight class than Haye has?

 

its funny how many people do not have a clue what P4P means . . . lol. The definition is in its own phrase for god sake.

Froch might have a greater legacy or a better record but P4P Haye is better

 

Froch, but it is closer than some people are suggesting.

 

:yep I know it's crazy

 

I do have Rigo in my top 10 and GGG in my top 20.

your record is only a gauge of you skill and boxing ability. The best fighter on the planet maybe somewhere in the rainforest but if we have not seen him fight then we would never know how good he was.

As for Froch yes he has wins over Dirrell but many thinks he lost or actually Dirrell gave it away. He was losing badly until Taylor ran out of gas. Yes the KO looks good but he looked like **** up until that point. He fought a good fight against Kessler, but still lost. Finally, Ward completely embarrassed him. Yes, he beat Bute badly so now everyone is saying he is all that . . . lol.

As a heavyweight, Haye has faster hands, quicker reflexes, throws better combos, (if he was a SMW he would twice as fast and quick) has better defense, and an underrated chin (he took some clean shots from Wlad). Haye is a better boxer, Froch is a better fighter . . . if they could ever meet at the exact same weight (ad******g all the attributes) I would Pick Haye all day everyday.

P4P Haye, if you are talking ATG status I would Pick Froch because I weigh that more on record then skill and ability

 

:yep

 

I'm sure you know how ridiculous this is when you're having to big up Enzo, Frago and Chisora.

Ruiz was at least as done as Taylor, and unlike JT, doesn't have 2 wins over an ATG. In fact has a loss to a blown up lhw one.

Pascal went on to beat p4p Dawson for 175 lineal crown. Mormeck went on to rob Oquendo, but at least didn't have any rounds shortened like when he was running from Bell in the rematch.

 

I tend to think this, but the HW division is rather weak regardless of the weight disadvantage. Froch fights a much higher class of fighters.

 

Tell me how I bigged them up?

Those wins over Hopkins were at MW, by the time he fought Froch was clearly burnt out and pretty much finished, in his next fight at SMW he got destroyed. Taylor went on to take a hiatus from the sport, now he's returned at 160 but to me he looks completely shot and should retire. It's hardly a good win, though the fight was exciting, especially the finish.

Pascal beat Dawson years later at LHW, a weight which he is clearly more comfortable at. At SMW, he did next to nothing. I haven't seen Mormeck's rematch with Bell, but he was a unified CW champion when Haye knocked him out in Mormeck's backyard.

The only prime accomplished SMW that Froch beat was Bute, and he clearly turned out to be overrated. We'll see how much he does in the future.

 

Yes.

Magee
Pascal
Taylor
Dirrell
Abraham
Johnson
Bute

is better than....

Mormeck
Enzo
Barrett
SNV
Harrison
Chisora

by quite a distance.

:deal

Exactly.

You can't say Pascal was crap, unproven granted but Froch did a job on him, in his 2nd fight back he won the 175lb title and then handed Dawson his ass. Clearly not a joke opponent by any means.

Agreed.

Haye only moved up to HW because he knew he'd beat some of them.

If a welterweight sees a crap middleweight champion and beats him, so what?

Haye IS a HW, who cut to cruiser.

You're one of the best posters on here, I'm surprised at the wooden nature of this offering.

It's akin to something that Bailey would post, saying that so and so is a journeyman at one weight and a world class operator only a ham sandwich heavier.

Come on man!


Froch is better than Haye. Better resume, better technically, just.... better full stop.

 

Thanks for the compliment

I see what you mean, my post does sell Froch somewhat short, and that isn't fair. My point was, that it's closer than people think and Haye does deserve credit for facing guys that significantly outweigh him. No doubt that if Haye faced a Kessler or Ward level of opponent he would lose as well.

As for the final point, I'm not sure that Froch is better than Haye technically. Froch does have a much better jab and a much better chin though.

 

:good

I think that Haye would lose to Kessler & Ward level fighters too, good point.

Froch to me is better technically, Haye has gone backwards to me since he beat Macarinelli, the way he delivers his right hands is awful compared to back then....

Haye ought to have had a better career than Froch, but unfortunately he's spent too much time on the sidelines or fighting bums like Audley. Froch has left it all in the ring.

 

Is this even a question

 

^ This


Can't beleive he is even trying to big up Chisora,Ruiz and Valuev !

 

Froch and it's not close.