Carlos Ortiz vs Kostya Tszyu at 140

Oh.... If only Whitaker had remained at JW/W for another few years... rather than claiming the title and escaping asap.. moving on to claim 'a version' of the W/W and jM/W crowns... albeit, with a nose full of cocaine in his finest performance ..

I guess we all have a personal veiw of what makes a champion. I'd be a pleased man to witness both of these men at their finest. Clearly, Whitaker was dynamite at L/W.. undisputed champ.. Tszyu, claimed the JW/W div.

Given the chance to see both men, prime 4 prime, at the same age, I'd still have my money on Tszyu. Just remember, we lost a good deal of Tszyu's career due to managerial issues and injury.... not an excuse, a legitimate reason. Hence, Tsyzu boxed on 5 occasssions between Nov. 2001, and June 2005.... stilll defending his undisputed crown 3 times in that period... and the IBF crown once, whilst aged 32, 33, 34... before finally succombing to Hatton, TKO-11, at 35 y/o... A lot of inactivity... yet, very little can be taken from Tszyu... or Whitaker for that matter.

 

I don't see why Kosta's faulted for going the distance against Mayweather. We're talking about a few fight novice against a extremely experienced veteran.

 

Kostya was no Ray Lovato :good

 

Whitaker owns all these clowns. Them all.

 

Tyszu is very good, an A- level fighter, with very exploitable weaknesses, Ortiz and Whitaker are 2 of the greatest P4P fighters ever with little exploitable weaknesses because they were so skilled

Tyszu's weaknesses - slow hand speed, poor defensively, often outboxed for periods, relies on landing the big shots that wouldn't happen against better defensive fighters and men who backed him up.

Lets look at some Tyszu facts:

Hatton - Hatton beat Kostya to the punch and outboxed him, Hatton isnt a boxer near the level of Ortiz/Whitaker.

Ukral - Euro level Ukral made it a hard fight and won 4 rounds

Hurtado - put him down twice, and they were hard KD's, Hurtado did have a china chin and was stopped in 1 by Vivian Harris

Mitchell - Stevie Johnston left overs and not top class. Outboxed Tyszu for periods

Judah - made a horrible defensive mistake that no top level boxer would make and is chinny.

Phillips - outbrawled and destroyed by an underrated Phillips who was never

If you get outboxed and hurt by the likes of these lesser level opponents imagine what superior men like Whitaker and Ortiz would do with superior offensive abilities and defenses that Tyszu would struggle to land on.

Tyszu didnt fight the best of his era, the likes of: Delahoya, Trinidad, Mosley, Mayweather and he probably loses to them all.

This reasoning ignores styles but my contention is Tyszu was too defensively vunerable and too slow to beat greats such as these. His only chance against Ortiz is landing something big or outmuscling him as Tyszu was much the bigger man, but Tyszu's power is a little overrated as it is, his best shots likely dont land and Ortiz is far better than Hatton, Phillips and co

 

I'm not a Tszyu fan at all... but I dunno where you get off saying Tszyu was slow. Tszyu's hands were FAR from slow. Ortiz and Whitaker still beat him, I'm just saying... Tszyu had fast hands.

 

Relatively slow, Hatton beat him to the punch, Mitchell beat him to the punch, so did Judah, so did Hurtado. Relatively speaking Tyszu is slowish, he can throw the right hand like a bullet at times though yes, a great boxer simply stays out of range of the right, or lands his shots first

 

Tszyu was way past it in the Hatton fight so I dont even count that. I believe a prime Tszyu would have smashed Hatton.

Zab Judah beat him to the punch for ONE round, before being caught, and Judah has some of the fastest hands ever. Mitchell was a fast guy too, and suggesting he "outboxed" Tszyu is a stretch. Tszyu was ahead in the first fight when Mitchell quit, and destroyed Sharmba in the rematch.

From what Ive seen of Ortiz, his hands werent faster than Tszyu's, nor was he as explosive a one punch hitter. He was a better technician though, and tougher, and that would be the differance.

 

Find some footage of the Hatton/Tszyu weigh in.... you will clearly see a discoloured, drained looking Tszyu.... No excuse... Hatton belted him.

 

Hurtado, the previous year, had Pernell beaten on all cards, until being carelessly stopped in the 11th.. Tszyu put him to sleep.

Mitchell I, Tszyu hadn't boxed in 7 months.. put him to sleep in the rematch...

Urkal??? 4 rounds doesnt win a 12 round fight.......

Phillips? Tszyu made an excuse... the wrong choice of amino's in the diet. Complained of little endurance... Perhaps Sweet Pea should have offered his own 'stimulant'.. All and sundry were shocked at the result.. The result remains, no excuses accepted by me.

Tszyu, regarding his style, made it clear in numerous interviews, that his willingness to absorb the opponents punch related to 2 things..
1. He believed his chin was superior to any fighter..2. His return counter would soon pull up any man.

 

The fight with Sweet pea almost came off! Bill Mordey was putting the fight together at welter just after tszyu had won the Jr welter Title.The plan was to fight Whitaker for his welter title for $1.3 million US. If tszyu was outpointed he still had the Jr welter title .Tszyu pulled the pin on Mordeys contract and stayed with Sky channel Which end up costing Tszyu 8.4 million Aus.

 

Correct, and bloody ridiculous.. What the hell did Tszyu see in Wharton??? Other than connection via the blood lines. Jake Rodriquez went on to fight Whitaker.... cop that!!!! A true gentlman Rodriguez was. Nice bloke.
Had Tszyu remained with Mordey, as cheeky as Mordey presented, Tszyu would have been exposed to formidable fighters, more frequently, in the US, with genuine rewards and appreciation.

The rubbish involved with the Hugo Pineda fight, stripped a further AU$700,000 from the Tszyu finances.

"Break Even" Bill deserved the mantle of Tszyu career.. Not some half witted car-salesman that Vlad was. Thankfully, Kostya and Bill resolved their differences, prior to Bill departing the earth. Good bloke was Mordey also... had a good many bourbans with him at several fight nights. R.I.P

 

Rumor was Wharton owed 50 grand for the rental of the venue of the Pineda fight for Years.