Let's say they fight at catchweight, 154lbs.. who wins? I'd go for Sam Langford by brutal knockout in the middle rounds I think this is a very interesting matchup.
However, I should point out that Langford was less consistent than most people can imagine, his fights with Harry Wills and Bill Tate were more or less disappointing, and should be pointed out when someone puts him in the top pound for pound list... sure he had some good fights from lightweight up to heavyweight, but he lost hella lot for a fighter that's supposed to be a ATG.
At 154 I think Basilio's chances start to diminish considerably....I have the utmost respect for Basilio at welter, for his strength and relentlessness...At 147, Basilio gives anyone in history a good run...he could be outboxed sure...but he gives a respectable effort against anyone. I'll go out on a limb here...I may pick Basilio at welter to win this...It may be possible for Carmen to consistantly beat him to the punch, and with a more refined style than Langford, perhaps Basilio by decision. Also due to the fact that Langford was young. Pure speculation though...Langford was simply a phenomenon... Logic cannot explain how he was able to engage much bigger and stronger men....It is astounding!
Basilio hasn`t a snowballs chance in hell of winning this one as he gets KOed whenever Sam decides he`s had enough fun of carrying Basilio. Carmen never fought anyone who was as strong or hit so damn hard. The 5' 7" to 5' 9" depending on who your listening to Langford hit hard enough to KO the 6' 4" 225 to 230lb Harry Wills twice with one shot the 1st time with a left hook and the second with a right hand. WILLS SAID LATER THAT HE NEVER SAW EITHER PUNCH THAT SAM HIT HIM WITH AND HE HAD SAM IN A BAD WAY UP AGAINST THE ROPES AND CUT OVER BOTH EYES WHEN THE LIGHTS WENT OUT BOTH TIMES WAKING UP ON THE DRESSING ROOM TABLE. LANGFORD KOs BASILIO ANYTIME HE WANTS TO END IT.
Basilio has MORE than a show balls hell in a chance to beat Langford, Langford was not relly a dancing master, This will be a real brawl. I may lead with Carman, but it will be a hell of a fight.
No chance what so ever as Langford would slaughter the welterweight inside for 5rds if it even would go that long and if you don`t believe me just ask one of the other historians on the planet if what I say is true. He was a great little welterweight but when he got to the middleweight division he was out of his class. Today in the middleweight division as poor as it is he would do some good but then there was just to many strong middies like GENE FULLMER to deal with and Carmen just couldn`t deal with FULLMER OR TIGER who was equally as strong at middleweight. A better match up would be LANGFORD VS FULLMER OR TIGER as they were strong enough to give LANGFORD a real fight. LANGFORD went 6 rds with STAN KETCHEL which was a barn burner for 6 rds. Unknowing people now want to cloud the facts of the fight by saying LANGFORD carried KETCHEL but the facts are that SAM LANGFORD talked about the fight like this that He had it easy the first three rounds but KETCHEL hit him with a right to the short ribs that he thought caved them in after that he had to fight Ketchel off as he had to keep him from his ribs. KETCHEL came on from the 4th rd on to draw even with LANGFORD at the end of the 6th rd. VERY SIMPLE BASILIO HASN`T A CHANCE AGAINST LANGFORD.
In this mythical matchup of course we have to remember that both fighters would be at the same weight of 154 lbs. I think that most of us are thinking that we would be throwing poor Carmen in as a welter-middleweight against Sam Langford who most of us think of as a great heavyweight fighter. And of course that would be nothing short of a massacre. Carmen was a great welterweight champion and also effective at 154 lbs. 160 was not a good weight for him. A Gene Fullmer or Dick Tiger who were both big middleweights were both too big and strong for him. He was able to compete evenly with Robinson. He fought his last fight with Pender and actually did fairly well considering that he injured his left shoulder in the second round and fought the remaining 13 rounds with his right hand. He was even able to rock Pender to his heels late in the fight with that right hand. So maybe if Basilio and Langford weigh the same it might not be as one-sided as we might think. I haven't seen any footage of Sam Langford but have read alot about him. According to historians he was a great one.
Basilio did GREAT in the middleweights, he got a win over Robinson, and held a close fight in the rematch. Sure he lost to Pendler and Fullmer, but outside of that, he had a pretty good run. Carman is one of the FEW fighters you cant just write off. It will be a war, but I favor Basilio in a 15 rounder, with both getting there lumps and bruises.
Fullmer did not outbox Basilio, where the hell do you get that from he ran him over like a fright train and beat him into submission. Something else where do you get Basilio did well at middleweight. Except for Ray Robinson, Gene Fullmer and Paul Pender, Basilio did fight any other true middleweights as Don Jordan, Gaspar Ortaga, Art Aragon were like Baslio blown up welterweights. Hell. Harold Jones was a blown up lightweight. Basilio fought Peter Mueller and it went like most of the fights with the Europeian fighters he beat him up so it really doesn`t count. BASILIO DID NOTHING AT MIDDLEWEIGHT YOU SHOULD REALLY STUDY YOU BOXING HISTORY BEFORE YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT YOU DO NOT KNOW. THIS IS WHY AFTER 3 YRS I HAVE COME BACK ON TO THE SITE AS I KEEP READING CRAP THAT IS BOTH ERRONEOUS AND JUST PLAIN WRONG. THE ONLY TIME FULLMER TRIED TO OUT BOX ANYONE AND CHANGE HIS STYLE WAS AGAINST DICK TIGER WHO WAS AS STRONG AS HE WAS IN THE TRENCHES. FULLMER GAVE IT A GOOD TRY BUT TIGER BEAT THE HELL OUT OF FULLMER.
I'm a longtime Basilio fan, but Langford would be too strong, too hardhitting, and too savvy for Basilio. Basilio would be there to be hit, and Langford would HIT him!!! Langford KO8 Basilio. Grebfan9 www.firstroundboxing.com
BIG DEE HERE= Grebfan9 your right on the money as you said it perfectly Basilio was there to be hit and Langford would hit him. An excellent choice of words. By the name you go by I gather you like Harry Greb a little bit. I was told for 40 years that I was wrong about Harry Greb. I said that Greb was the greatest Middleweight and p4p fight who ever lived. I was told Sugar Ray Robinson over and over till I got sick of it. Well the boxing writers got together and made the IBRO and vindecated me after all those years naming Greb the greatest Middleweight of all-time but not p4p. Maybe someday but he`s going on my tombstone saying he the greatest middleweight of all-time.
