Charley Burley on Sugar Ray Robinson

This is a fair point; and yet the two fighters Sugar ducked most savegely were The Cocoa Kid and Charley Burley. I can't find much concerning Sugar's thoughts/opinions on Holman Williams, how about you OF? Q? Anyone?

Thread Stealer - I think you've picked the right passage for quotation. Burley was an honest character (obviously), and I personally believe what he's saying in a wider sense. I also think he would have given RObinson clean hell.

 

A few things here.

Firstly, Burley-Robinson was all but on late 1946. I'm guessing the fight would have been held at MW, though Burley quite possibly still could have made the WW limit though he was fighting mostly at around 160 by this time. Robinson, who, at that time, wa fighting for purses of between 7 and 12,000 dollars, supposedly doubled his demands for a Burley fight from a career best payday of 25k to 50k. Now that only means one thing in this business, doens't it? Burley had just mashed a light-heavyweight contender and huge puncher in Billy Smith. As with his one and only New York jaunt, it's my guess that he looked to good doing it and hurt his chances at a bigger fight (it's said Burley looked far better in the rematch than the first match - perhaps because there was no reason to let Smith think he would have a chance in the next one).

The fight fell through, but by the beginning of the following year the money, and more HAD been put together. But Robinson, LaMotta and Cerdan all declined the career's best payday (LaMotta on the matter: "What do I need Burley for when I have Zivic?).

I think you make a fair point about size differential, although it should be noted that Burley's various managers had been trying to make that fight for YEARS before terms were finally agreed. Whilst Armstrong and Zivic are both perhaps more shameless in their ducks, the Robinson one is there for anyone who cares to take a look.

As for Cocoa Kid, Robinson was actually scheduled to meet with him at a charity funciton. Robinson, upon hearing the name of his illustrious opponent, up until then a mystery to him, ducked out. Fair enough actually; Roy Jones wouldn't have fought James Toney on one hours notice. But perhaps Robinson should have gone back and cleared up that particular mess?

 

Thanks for saying so.

Rosenfeld's The Life And Times of an Uncrowned Champion is really, really strong on the era. For example the LaMotta quote, "what do I need Burley for when I got Zivic" comes from this extraordinary book - read this one and you'll come out the back an awful lot wiser about all of these guys, Williams, Cocoa Kid and of course, Charley Burley. Although it's pretty readable, it's also very dense - I think it would be of only limited value if you were after a casual read, I think that to get teh best out of this book you need to take a few notes about the stuff that is of interest to you, because it is unlikley you'll be able to find what your after when you come to the book.

Lighter, though also very good is Otty's book, as quoted in the opening post. Otty was championing Burley for years before the book, and his website

http://www.charleyburley.com/index.htm

is a great place to start finding out about Burley, as well as the rest of the Murderer's Row. Otty is particularly strong on Eddie Booker, which is good, because Rosenfeld is perhaps a bit weak on him.

Anyway, the Otty book is a great read, and is especially strong on the Robinson duck - but Otty may be an overly sympathetic narrator, though it's understandable. He went to the trouble of tracking Charley down and speaking with him, right at the end, when it seemed basically nobody in the sport was interested (Aside from Moore and Futch).

If you go for Rosenfeld, you will be furious by the end of the book when Allen outlines how little interest the world of boxing had in Charley's passing. It's a great shame that his friends had to do the legwork to get his passing noticed, even in publications like The Ring.

Burley has a MySpace page, too, which is interesting, the Billy Smith film is embedded there.

 

It's a deeply surreal page. The musical peice under "about me" may leave your jaw hanging...relevant? I still can't be sure.