Chavez vs Sweet Pea. Who ranks higher all time?

I don't have a problem with it either. Chavez was a physically stronger fighter than Whitaker and carried the weight well enough. Nelson just wasn't a lightweight. It was a bridge too far for him. He fought Jesse James Leija for something called the IBA lightweight title but other than that didn't campaign as a lightweight.

 

Sweet Pea.

Whitaker - anywhere between 4 - 10
Chavez - anywhere between 20 - 35

 

Ah I get ya.

But I dont think the fact he didnt fight at lightweight again means nearly as much as you want to make out though nat.

Azumah was one of the strongest feather-superfeather fighters to ever lace them up and I think he wasnt necessarily the weaker man in there against Pea. I also think Azumah weighing in at 130 would have been able to muscle around just about any 135 pounder around at the time.

Nelson wasnt at his his absolute peak perhaps but his best win since the Gomez fight was to follow the Pea loss when he went over to Fenech's backyard and gave him a touch up.

Its a legit win over an ATG who was still obviously quite capable and well inside the p4p rankings at the time I believe...I dont feel those extra few pounds were the determining factor nor did that really hinder Nelson dramatically, I feel Pea was just better and stylistic poison for Azumah no matter what weight they are fighting at.

 

MrMarvel (or is it Chris Warren/ Woody?), "This is disappointing," "He is greater," are not arguments to begin with, so how can you expect a counterargument to them?

 

Consider that Azumah Nelson still performed better in that fight though than guys like Ramirez and Haugen, who did have solid lightweight credentials. I think I'd favour that Nelson to beat the likes of Haugen, Nazario, and aging Rosario if he came up against them in 1990.

I think Azumah moving down in weight after the fight had something to do with the fact that Whitaker was in the process of cleaning out the division. Why would he hang around for another fight there? To get owned again?

Maybe the Nelson win is blown out of proportion as far as Whitaker's wins go, but Nelson showed that he was still the stronger fighter in the ring that night with Whitaker and Pea didn't look all that bigger than Nelson either.

 

These are guys are about equal,although i thought Whittaker deserved the decision,I think it was just a matter of the old cliche "styles make fights".Chavez kod Mayweather twice,someone who was more competetive with whittaker than chavez,i know you cant always base that on whos better but just a comparison. Also Chavez Stopped Ramirez and Haugen 2 guys that went the distance with Whittaker. Just cause Norton and Fraizer basically fought Ali even does that put them on par with Ali? No i didnt thinkso. Young beat Foreman does that make him the greater fighter? I think both of these guys are higher than many people on this post put them Id say both are in the 10 to 15 atg pfp range.

 

In depends on how you scored the Chavez, De La Hoya fights. Both are arguably Top 15. I personally have Sweet Pea at the 11th or 12th spot with Chavez not that far behind him (probably 14th).

 

Probably because it was 86-1 really. Still, that's a fine record but Whitaker should, and usually is, ranked higher.

 

Ah I get ya.

But I dont think the fact he didnt fight at lightweight again means nearly as much as you want to make out though nat.

Azumah was one of the strongest feather-superfeather fighters to ever lace them up and I think he wasnt necessarily the weaker man in there against Pea. I also think Azumah weighing in at 130 would have been able to muscle around just about any 135 pounder around at the time.

Nelson wasnt at his his absolute peak perhaps but his best win since the Gomez fight was to follow the Pea loss when he went over to Fenech's backyard and gave him a touch up.

Its a legit win over an ATG who was still obviously quite capable and well inside the p4p rankings at the time I believe...I dont feel those extra few pounds were the determining factor nor did that really hinder Nelson dramatically, I feel Pea was just better and stylistic poison for Azumah no matter what weight they are fighting at.
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You guys make compelling arguments which I respect. I'll leave it at that.

 

Meant to quote you above too.

 

Whitaker

 

JCC top 10 easily ... only the jealous americans can't see that

Pea .. Top 15

 

I watched Chavez vs Haugen yesterday and saw one of the best if not the best combination puncher of all time at work I love Chavez, I think he's overlooked by many here at ESB, mainly contributors to the General, as being a one dimensional plodder. Chavez to me was the best ever at what he did. A come forward pressure fighter, throwing three or four punches to head and body. All hard shots, and so fluid and beautiful to watch. His defense is underrated too. Great head movement at times, picking off a lot of his opponents work with his gloves.

With all that said, Chavez is definitely not a top 10 fighter, and I'd be interested in hearing your reasons for thinking otherwise?

 

I agree with this.