Classics that never happened

Great list, though hate to say it, Aaron Pryor would've killed Howard Davis Jr.:good

 

Going by the debate on here, i suggest Rockysplitnose v Klompton

 

Mine are:
Jeff Chandler - Lupe Pintor (mentioned)
Salvador Sanchez - Eusebio Pedroza (mentioned)
Saad Muhammad - Mustafa II

 

neither of you can quote properly. Paki *******s.

 

Yeah but Davis was a golden boy serial soft chinned ducker,just for kicks i would liked to see him get laid out.lol

 

The fact that you think Dempsey having a chance of beating Wills would be to defy logic is plain ridiculous - and if you think that beleiving the reverse is true would be an excercise in hero worship or racism - suggests you have a problem with any white man that thinks another white man could beat a black man - pretty much the definition of reverse racism - that's what rascist whites thought about blacks back in the days of Jack Johnson - blacks would be be deserving of a good whippin back in the days of Johnson if they were too vocal in their support of him - you're expressing the same attitude toward me in trying to belittle the idea that Dempsey would even have a chance with Wills

-Go over to thread on Marvin Hart if this is your contention...



WHAT EVIDENCE!!??? YOU REALLY ARE TALKING HORSE **** - YOU SAY THAT AS THOUGH THERE IS SOME STONE COLD HARD FACT THE ABSOLUTELY PROVES WILLS WOULD BEAT DEMPSEY

-The evidence is the fact that Dempsey consistently chose to face lesser opposition for seven straight years despite his supposed confidence in his abilities.



AGAIN UTTER BULL - NEVER EVEN SUGGESTED THIS - JUST MAKING THE POINT THAT BACK IN THE DAY IT REALLY WASN'T VIEWED AS THAT BIG A DEAL - IT'S ONLY AS THE YEARS HAVE PASSED THAT EVERYONE HAS MADE A BIGGER DEAL OUT OF IT THAN IT WAS AT THE TIME - BUT YEAH DEMPSEY-WILLS SHOULD DEFINATELY HAVE HAPPENED AS I SAID - IT WOULD'VE CLEARED UP THE DEBATE AND I AM OF THE BELIEF THAT AS A RESULT WILLS WOULD NOT BEEN AS MISTAKENLY VIEWED AS HE HAS SINCE.



- How in the same sentence can you deny that you have minimized the impact that this had on the psyche of the boxing public at the time while at the same time say that you are just making a point that it wasnt a big deal and has only become so in the years since. This is the height of ignorance on your part. If promoters across the continent are fighting over the right to stage the bout, newspapers are holding national polls which determine Wills to be the clear leader, hell Dempsey was even banned from fighting in NY for NOT facing Wills resulting in his fight against Tunney being pushed to Philadelphia. But its your contention that it wasnt a big deal. This right here, this statement alone illustrates that you have no understanding of what was going on around this time period much less the fact that you have stated that none of the books you have read ever mention Wills... I find this absolutely ridiculous comment interesting considering without even trying hard I can find a wealth of information on Dempsey and the Wills fiasco with a quick scan of my boxing library: The Idol of Fistiana by Fleisher devotes a chapter to it, Randy Roberts book devotes quite a bit of print to it, Mel Heimer devotes quite a bit print to it, Dempsey himself in his books discusses it at length (putting the appropriate spin on it of course), Bruce J. Evensen discusses it in some detail as well. Im actually curious which books on Dempsey you have read that DONT mention and how you can read newspapers of that era without coming across at least weekly discussion on Wills-Dempsey such was its topical nature at the time and to this day...


HOW COULD YOU EVEN POSSIBLY KNOW THIS - THIS IS JUST WHAT YOU WANT TO BELEIVE SO YOU CAN CONTINUE TO BOLSTER THE CHIP ON THAT SHOULDER OF YOURS - THE FIGHT WAS LEGITIMATELY MADE TWICE - AND THEN ALSO WILLS TURNED DOWN THE OFFER OF AN ELIMINATOR AGAINST TUNNEY - AND THEN GOT HIS ASS WHOOPED BY SHARKEY WHO WOULD THEN LOSE TO DEMPSEY.


-Lets back up here first and foremost: Tex Rickard never, NEVER made that fight. That is a fact. It has since been reported that he did because tickets that he had printed up were circulated but the fact is that Rickard never signed either Dempsey, or Wills to a fight. Rickard had Dempsey and Wills sign a contract that stated that if an offer was made for the bout under reasonable terms it would be held within 60 days. No offer was ever made by Rickard (who signed the damn thing) and the terms, date, and location were left blank as well. In essence it was a meaningless and worthless piece of paper. Wills had to sign it because it was as close as he could get to a title shot and Dempsey of course signed because then he could and did use it as an example of his willingness to face Wills. The fact of the matter is thought that Paddy Mullins, Will's manager tried to insert clauses into the contract that would have made it more binding and guaranteed Wills a fight for the title to which Kearns refused. It was a joke and the fact that it was meaningless was lost on no one. Fitzsimmons, a close friend of Dempsey's signed the two fighters for a fight BUT he signed the fight under terms that both he and Dempsey, and Kearns knew were undeliverable and when he missed his first deadline for a payment who was odd man out? Fitzsimmons lost nothing, Dempsey lost nothing, only Wills was left out in the cold. If you choose to believe this is how things are done legitimately then thats fine but it also illustrates why you are Floyd Mayweather fan...



NO IT WOULDN'T - YOU JUST GOING INTO AN ANGRY RANT NOW PINNING EVERY WHITE MAN AS AN OUT AN OUT WHITE SUPREMACIST KKK FOLLOWER - AGAIN YOU ARE EXPRESSING STRONG REVERSE RASCISM HERE INSINUATING THINGS LIKE THAT WITH NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER OUT OF PURE FRUSTRATION.

-No I am stating a fact. And I will state it again. If Dempsey had thought he could have demolished Wills in 2 rounds he would have. Period. Its as simple as that. There was literally no other reason for that fight not being held. Not the color bar, not lack of funds, not political pressure, nothing. It is a plain and simple fact that if Dempsey, Rickard, and Kearns felt he would have easily knocked out Wills they would have signed that fight in a heartbeat, even if they couldnt make money on it which they would have, and once Dempsey knocked Wills out they could have fought whoever they wanted for the next ten years and been considered the best thing since sliced bread. Instead Dempsey took three years off and when he finally did come back it was with his tail between his legs and looking for a venue to fight Tunney because Tunney's hometown would not allow it due to the joke Dempsey had made of his #1 contender. The fact that he chose Tunney ought to tell you something because he never in a million years believed he would lose to a smaller, lighter hitting, defensive fighter who had been better known for his careful matchmaking than for his devastating climb to contention.


YEAH HE REALLY PROVED HIS WORTH IN COMPARISON WITH FIRPO DIDN'T HE - DEMPSEY OBLITERATED HIM IN 1 AND A HALF ROUNDS YET FIRPO WENT 12 WITH WILLS SO YEAH WILLS WAS LEAGUES AHEAD OF FIRPO WASN'T HE?? IF WILLS WAS SO MORE QUALIFIED WHY DIDN'T HE MAKE SHORT WORK OF HIM??

-Yeah and Dempsey was down and out of the ring and life and death with a crude slugger while Wills dominated him from round 1 to round 12. Big deal. How does Wills dominating Firpo in any way shape or form translate into Wills not being a more worthy challenger than anyone Dempsey defended against?


NEITHER OF THESE VIEWS DISPROVE THE NOTION THAT DEMPSEY WOULD STILL HAVE BEATEN WILLS - I'M NOT ARGUING AGAINST EITHER OF THOSE POINTS EITHER

-You are right but there is no proof that Dempsey would have beaten Wills. None whatsoever.


TRUST ME ALL I NEED TO KNOW IS THAT THE STRONG IMPRESSION I GET FROM SEEING WILLS ON FILM AND LOOKING AT A LOT OF HIS RESULTS ETC ETC IS THAT WILLS WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN A MATCH FOR JACK DEMPSEY

-Once agian, your impression is of a 37 year old man who is by now a broken down and disillusioned fighter who spent nearly a decade at the top of his division being ignored by your hero. Thats like saying Joe Frazier sucked because you only saw him against Jumbo Wells, or Ali sucked because you only saw him against Holmes, or Moore sucked because you only saw him against Patterson. You have essentially taken arguably Wills' worst performance and judged his entire career on it. That is ignorant.



WHAT YOU ACTUALLY MEAN IS WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING THIS ARGUMENT IF YOU WEREN'T SO OFFENDED BY A WHITE MAN THINKING ANOTHER WHITE MAN COULD EVER BEAT A BLACK MAN

-I am white, and if you believe that once again go over to the Marvin Hart posts and read what I written.

You arent and have admitted that in several instances or illustrated it through some of your arguments. If you continue to choose to walk blindly without actually seeking the truth then who is the one who is biased or racist?

DID YOU GET THAT **** FROM SAMUEL L JACKSON ON PULP FICTION?

Sounds a lot like the ignorant ideologies of those your grandfather foughtatsch

THE IGNORANT IDEOLOGIES OF MY GRANDAD - NOW YOU ARE SCRAPING THE BARREL - TRYING TO RUN DOWN MY DEPARTED GRANDAD - YOU'VE JUST PROVED WHAT A SCUMBAG YOU REALLY ARE - HOW THE FCK DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY GRANDAD? oH SORRY I FORGOT YOU THINK ALL WHITE MEN ARE PURE EVIL WHITE SUPREMACISTS AND SLAVE MASTERS - YOU REALLY NEED TO LET GO OF ALL THAT **** MAN

-Reread my post dumbass. I said ignorant ideologies that your grandfather FOUGHT... Although given your single minded devotion to a myth aryan superiority I would guess that it wasnt on the side of the Allies that your grandfather fought LOL

 

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post continued

-No I am stating a fact. And I will state it again. If Dempsey had thought he could have demolished Wills in 2 rounds he would have. Period. Its as simple as that. There was literally no other reason for that fight not being held. Not the color bar, not lack of funds, not political pressure, nothing. It is a plain and simple fact that if Dempsey, Rickard, and Kearns felt he would have easily knocked out Wills they would have signed that fight in a heartbeat, even if they couldnt make money on it which they would have, and once Dempsey knocked Wills out they could have fought whoever they wanted for the next ten years and been considered the best thing since sliced bread. Instead Dempsey took three years off and when he finally did come back it was with his tail between his legs and looking for a venue to fight Tunney because Tunney's hometown would not allow it due to the joke Dempsey had made of his #1 contender. The fact that he chose Tunney ought to tell you something because he never in a million years believed he would lose to a smaller, lighter hitting, defensive fighter who had been better known for his careful matchmaking than for his devastating climb to contention.

Dempsey might not of 'thought' he could've wiped out any of his top opponents as quick as he actually did - he was usually very gracious to his opponents and not given to making claims about how quick he could knock anyone out - he was terrified by the thought of Jess Willard (and angry at Kearns betting his purse on a first round KO) but look what Dempsey actually did to Jess - again Demps thought he was in serious danger of being KO'd had he been caught flush by Firpo but he went in and slugged it out with him and ended up wiping him out -Dempsey would've had legitimate fear of Wills and probably would've thought 'my god this is going to be one tough fight' - but fact is that's exactly what he thought about a lot of his toughest opponents naturally - again this is no proof that Dempsey wouldn't in any way be able to beat Wills???

-Yeah and Dempsey was down and out of the ring and life and death with a crude slugger while Wills dominated him from round 1 to round 12. Big deal. How does Wills dominating Firpo in any way shape or form translate into Wills not being a more worthy challenger than anyone Dempsey defended against?

-You are right but there is no proof that Dempsey would have beaten Wills. None whatsoever.

Exactly!!!! That's been my whole point all along - your the one who has been insinuating that there is no way in the world that Dempsey would ever beat Wills!!!!?? So equally the is no evidence WHATSOEVER that Wills would beat Dempsey either?????!!!!! You just keep harping on that oh Dempsey avoided Wills so that means he was too scared to fight him so that means Wills would've destroyed him!!!


-Once agian, your impression is of a 37 year old man who is by now a broken down and disillusioned fighter who spent nearly a decade at the top of his division being ignored by your hero. Thats like saying Joe Frazier sucked because you only saw him against Jumbo Wells, or Ali sucked because you only saw him against Holmes, or Moore sucked because you only saw him against Patterson. You have essentially taken arguably Wills' worst performance and judged his entire career on it. That is ignorant.

Please don't even compare Wills with Ali or Frazier or Moore or Patterson - again Wills was not an elite fighter - he simply was not in there league -ps who is jumbo wells??


-I am white, and if you believe that once again go over to the Marvin Hart posts and read what I written.

Can't be bothered to read the stuff on Hart but you betray very strong issues with race so if you are white then you have been very misguided to the point where you can only see one theory to the story and can't read between the lines

You arent and have admitted that in several instances or illustrated it through some of your arguments. If you continue to choose to walk blindly without actually seeking the truth then who is the one who is biased or racist?

DID YOU GET THAT **** FROM SAMUEL L JACKSON ON PULP FICTION?

Sounds a lot like the ignorant ideologies of those your grandfather fought


-Reread my post dumbass. I said ignorant ideologies that your grandfather FOUGHT... Although given your single minded devotion to a myth aryan superiority I would guess that it wasnt on the side of the Allies that your grandfather fought LOL

AGAIN YOU KNOW ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT MY GRANDAD - AND MAKING INSULTS ABOUT MY DEAD RELATIVES AGAIN PROVES WHAT AN IDIOT YOU ARE - ANY RIGHT MINDED PERSON WOULD JUST LOSE ANY KIND OF RESPECT FOR YOU WHEN YOU STOOP TO MAKING FLIPPANT SLURS AGAINST PEOPLES DEAD RELATIVES

 

This is really, really gay.