[CLIP] Cus D'Amato reacts to Ali-Liston 2 during Post-Fight Interviews "Not Listons Fault!"

I haven't forgotten. But it just looks to me like he's purposefully trying to stay down as long as possible. But when the count never comes he feels forced to eventually get to his feet. That's just how it looks to me. I can't get passed that.

 

The KD definitely looks legit in my book. Him rolling around on the floor doesn't.

 

But, really, why is this such a much bigger deal than Marciano-Walcott II? Jersey Joe also looked like he took the opportunity to be counted out. I see no big difference.

 

Nah..its not about average black people, but the organisation called them self black muslim organisation, noz Sunni or Shia muslims, because there have different views, thats why malcom x, later became a sunni muslim and then got murdered, ali also became a sunni late in the 80´s.
For real muslims, the Black muslim´s are not muslims.
What ever, if this fight was a fix, only the looser would know, not the winner!

 

I know, but you never know what offends the mod these days

 

Fully accept this as a completely fair point.

Excellent point.

This was the flaw in the rematch clause. Sometimes the ex champ really dosnt want that rematch. He’s just contracted to take the same beating twice.

 

I lean this way too.

 

Get up and win by potential DQ?

 

Yes, for me as well.

 

The only time that Liston undoubtedly went down was the Martin KO which was at the end of his career, when he had the flu. That combo would've knocked out anybody! His chin was one of the best! That punch didn't have the power to knock Liston down let alone out.

 

You lost me when you said it was an "obviously leveraged properly" I'm thinking you're not sure what that looks like then, if you think that punch is a good example of one.

Tell me though, why is he screaming at Liston to get up, nobody will believe it if he thought it was such a great punch? With a straight keyboard face, you really believe Liston trying to get up and then toppling back down looked real to you? Really?

 

The odds were very different for the respective outcomes.

 

I’m not so certain about that. On film Sonny reacted to right hands from Bert Whithurst that had him wobble. The report of the Valdes and Foley fights both said he was stunned by a punch. and in the first Ali fight Sonny was wobbled too. Williams also hurt Sonny and whilst big cat knocked a lot of guys out, hardly any were actual world class.

For a guy usually so much bigger than the opposition we did see Sonny decked and wobbled on film by guys lighter than he was. Iam not certain it was an iron chin he had, whatever that means.

To be entirely fair to Liston though, all fighters will go down from a light punch if it is right on the button and they are not ready for it. All of them.

The guys that are credited with the best durability roll and ride punches better than people realise. And they are not the guys trying to punch or do any of the leading.

It’s the guys who are in the process of punching that are more susceptible to knocking themselves out when their own leverage is used against them.

 

But if you think Walcott didn't take a dive, but just didn't fancy to get up and receive a beating, it shouldn't be hard to believe that Liston thought the same way. And he shouldn't be judged more harshly.