Comparing fighters from the past with modern ones is complicated

Prime Foreman avoided weights like the plague and still had better power than these modern cuties

 

He really wasn't, Compare their physiques for a second here.
https://starschanges.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/George-Foreman-height-weight-age-768x541.jpg
https://e0.365dm.com/23/08/2048x115...usyk-daniel-dubois_6264722.jpg?20230827142234
Even both of them in a somewhat relaxed position shows that George was the much bigger guy, His frame was much bulkier. "Bigger" isn't weight. It's frame and George was one of the biggest guy's in boxing history.

 

The fighter with the fastest hands was Ali who was in his prime 60 years ago so the sport hasn’t evolved in this department

 

I don't think it's complicated at all, nor do I put much faith in modern training over old school training - Fit people are Fit, no matter how they get fit.

the simple means to compare is, find Proper Good Quality Film footage, there is plenty out there, from proper footage is is clear to see Proper Movement, Fighting and Skill, so in viewing that you can see there isn't much difference then to now... Except for One Fact.

and that is, 'most' of the Fighters including the Top Men, did it every month or so and for years... and that makes all the difference.

I don't care who you are as a fighter, or who you think you are, but double & triple your Fight Scheduled and that can, will and often does throw up a Career Trajectory.

Hell today top men won't even fight the other top men/contenders, never mind the other alphabet champions.

there's a major factor right there, take from it what you will, but it is Recorded History - the proof falls to the modern fighter to show they 'are', 'could be' or 'should be' seen as better, which I vehemently say, No you are not - they DID it, you have yet to show anything remotely close, 'generally' speaking for most of them.

 

Their not more skilled. Boxing skills in peaked the 1930's and 1940's. PreTelevision.
Boxing has evolved in the area of safety. No more 15 round fights. Bigger gloves, day before weigh ins, doctors are better equipment, referees stop fights much sooner than in the past.
Even the judging has changed. Aggressiveness carried alot more weight in the older days. Partially because people had to go to the fights in the past. They didn't sit on the couch and channel surf if the fight got boring. Give the Boxing fan a reason to leave his house and come see you fight.

The old time boxers were better, tougher and more skilled because they had to be. They fought more, more often and fought more during the fight.
"Fury would easily keep Ali at bay" I find this highly questionable. I'm not sure Tyson Fury could spar with Ali. They want to give the champ work but could Fury last a week? Maybe Ali tended to go easy on his sparring partners.

 

I agree, that boxing hasn't "evolved" since the late 30s/early 40s - where fantastic fighters like Louis, Pep and Robinson came on the scene.

That being said, I don't believe boxing has DEvolved since then - resulting in a sport today dominated by **** boxers, who couldn't hold their own against the oldtimers. Yes, yes, I know - this is the Classic forum, where the "thing" is to belittle modern fighters as much as possible. But the way I see it, there have been lots and lots of fine boxers over the last 80 years or so - even today, imo!

 

Boxing hasn't really devolved yet evolved,it stays the same but so far,there are many more bigger names today,the skills kept by the golden coaches just went by over time.

 

I think you have read my post in the reverse... I stated the Old Fighters are better all round...

I also said I don't believe modern training necessarily makes for fitter people.

I also agree with these changes in Boxing you have just mentioned, but I never said a word about any of that.

so, again, I think you have completely read my post wrong, I favoured the past as you have here.

 

Sure but Ali was also considered pretty big for the time and Usyk is around the same size as Ali.

 

Maybe.

But chances are a modern Joe Louis would have learned and adapted to current boxing styles, getting maximum advantage.
I can even imagine Louis adopting Wlad's "grab and clinch" style and snoozefesting his way to the Top...

Furthermore, Louis fought frequently and accumulated a lot of tear and wear.

Nowadays Louis could just pull a Tyson Fury or a Duckelo, fighting a tomato can once every 2-3 years and stay at the top forever

 

One of the things that help Louis get a title shot was he was fun to watch. People paid to see Louis knock people out. I can't image him getting a title shot any time soon in the 30's if he was grabbing and clinching his way in boring fights lol. Louis already had to pay ten percent for the next ten years for a title shot, you think he get a shot if he was boring as well?

 

Ali and Usyk are roughly the same size until Foreman goes to the body, then one of them is really short because they're in the fetal position on the canvas

 

I know what you're trying to say but I don't even think Usyk is Ali sized either. I think the best comparison we can do is compare him to the Ali of the Jimmy Young fight. Because that was Ali at his heaviest. Even then he looked similar to Usyk's current build with about 10lbs of extra weight.
https://media.gettyimages.com/id/17...=4IcIZ0OKwxoDWa59R7QgtbAEY_sjSfuasceNdtdRJd8=
Ali himself was actually a massive guy in his own right. The closest comparison I could actually find to Usyk's size was Larry holmes.
https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/i..._Holmes.png/revision/latest?cb=20200420152857
both 6'3 both look quite a bit pudgy but still athletic at 220lbs.