Comparing Holyfield`s power to Sonny Liston`s

Alex Stewart was K'oed multiple times in the prime of his career.
Machen was K'oed only once. More than likely Machen had a better chin than Stewart, possibly he was a better fighter all the way around.
To compare Holyfield's power to Liston's off of those two fights isn't wise Mark.
Its almost like saying just because Hearns and Mugabi couldn't knock-out Hagler, they actually didn't hit hard. I'm sure the combined 85 ko victims of those two fighters wouldn't agree.
The best way to judge this particular comparison is get the opnion of the man whom actually was in the ring with Holyfield and Liston.
Foreman never included Holyfield in his list of hardest punchers he's faced.

 

Like I always say in these threads. Anyone can inflict damage with an accurate well timed punch. Holyfield was a very accurate puncher who still struggled to deliver fight changing damage.

The guys you have to watch out for, are the ones that can hurt you with less than perfect form, accuracy and timing. Foreman, Baer, Liston, Marciano, Shavers ...etc.

 

He also said Ali and Holyfield's punching power were about the same but Ali had more speed and snap while Holyfield planted his feet and put more weight into his shots when throwing combos.

So unless someone thinks Ali had power comparable to Liston, the idea Holyfield had similar power to Liston is pretty absurd. I mean, you can simply watch the effects their punches have on their opponents. Holyfield threw everything but the kitchen sink at Bert Cooper and he wouldn't go down. Could you imagine Liston landing those same shots and Bert just stands there with his hands down? Couldn't KO Ruiz, Stewart, Lennox, Mercer, Bowe, fat old Holmes, etc. He just doesn't have murderous power at HW.

As for Liston vs Machen, Machen ran most of the fight and was a very slippery guy in his prime.

 

What you are saying is that you know Liston didn't put full starch into all of his punches in the actual Machen fight while Holyfield in his singular selected performance did.

As Matt said Liston scaled back and conserved at an early point against Machen who was extremely conservative.

It'shard to see "snap" in some of these old films. I firmly believe Liston's shots were sharper than they often seem. When both put some starch on their shots Liston hit harder by some distance. Holyfield hit quite hard, harder than sometimes given credit but he's certainly not in Liston's league.

 

His threads are different and are better than most of the predictable old heavyweight spam. He gets the odd one wrong like this one (IMO) but you can invariably expect something unique vs a retread.

Even this one is provoking interesting banter.

 

lol

 

lol, Tyson's punches weren't as heavy as Liston's though they were sharper. He was also much faster than Holy.

 

I think Liston power was 9/10, Holys 7/10 on the heavyweight power scale

 

Exactly. Not sure why some folks complain. The guy brings some energy here.

 

Comparable would be my feeling.

 

Mark, Holyfield did not knockout Stewart he stopped him there's a difference.

If Liston unloaded on Lewis he would die. Do you think Rahman and McCall hit way harder than Liston?

Holy did NOT step Mercer. Did you even watch the fight?

You can make all the excuses you want but the facts are Holyfield face many opponents and only had 2 noteworthy stoppages/knockouts: an out of shape fat Buster Douglas and past his prime Tyson. Almost every name or ranked opponent he faced at heavyweight went the distance with him or he stopped them on their feet more often than not. He has Very few actual knockouts. In his case his KO% is fairly accurate.

He simply wasn't a 1 punch KO artist, period. Liston has tons of brutal highlight KO's and knockdowns. To this day he has the fastest KO over a lineal HW champion. He KO'd 5 or 6 opponents who were ranked in the top 10. He has several knockouts within the first 3 rounds, including some over rated or durable opponents. Look at Liston hitting the heavy bag than Holyfield and tell me who you think has a bigger impact. There is no comparison.

Liston wasn't just getting "stoppages" he was bludgeoning guys into the canvas until they couldn't beat the count of 10 or were completely unconscious. That's the difference between a true puncher like Liston and a guy like Holyfield who hits hard enough to earn your respect but usually needs to land with high volume and 3-4 punches to get guys out of there.