Compton Vs Paxton Greb Books

louis54 · Sep 14, 2018

It you have one it's not necessary to by the other...both were good..

PeterD · Sep 14, 2018

I am a bit of a collector and own both books but haven't read the Paxton book as yet. Klompton's book was a classic of classics in my collection to be honest, loved it and it is one big book filled with photos and information.

I am assuming it will be the only book he will ever write (would love to be wrong) and if so, it is one to be proud of.

scribbs · Sep 15, 2018

he grant said: ↑

I have no clue if the thread is serious or just someone trying to get Klompton to go postal but assuming it's legit with all respect to Paxton there is no comparison. Klompton's book is as good as it gets.
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Yes it's serious as considering spending 30+ quid equivalent to 40+ bucks. Only use forums for genuine reasons as I have more interests than just boxing so would be pointless to wind people up for no reason, that's what my real life mates are for

scribbs · Sep 15, 2018

klompton2 said: ↑

This is just pulling it down off the shelf and thumbing through a few pages:

In the very first page of the first chapter: He tells the story of Greb being born in a car on the way to the hospital. This is absolute nonsense. Greb was born at home attended by a midwife named Mary Werle. He says that Greb was born on a street corner, Dauphin and Fitch. He absolutely was, that was his home address. Greb was born at 138 N Millvale Avenue in the Garfield section of Pittsburgh. 138 Millvale Avenue was on the corner of Millvale and Dauphin. Millvale Avenue had previously been Fitch. Hence, when Greb's birth record says he was born at the corner of Dauphin and Fitch its saying he was born at home. Which was the most common practice at the time. Nevermind that in 1894 basically nobody had a car. But he creates this ridiculous narrative that Greb's mother started giving birth to Greb on the way to the hospital and Greb was born right there in the street. He extrapolates this entire fantasy from what deems was a copy of Harry Greb's birth certificate pictured on Page 222. This was not Greb's birth certificate. Birth certificates were not issued in Pittsburgh in 1894. The only "birth certificate" that you will find of Greb is a logbook entry from 1894. The information that logbook entry holds was copied to this document upon request in 1953 as a "certified copy of birth record" This is all plainly visible, and again, anyone who simply looked at a map of Pittsburgh from the 1890s would have seen very quickly that Greb wasnt born in a car.

Same page: "It has been said that Harry Greb, born Edward Henry Greb, took the first name of an older brother who died at a young age. The story goes that Greb looked up to his older brother, so when Greb started fighting he took his name. This hasnt been verified." Wrong. The author didnt verify it which is sheer laziness. Its easily verifiable and the basic work that any author should do when writing about his subject. The first born child was a daughter, Lillian, born in 1892. She died in 1908. The second child was Edward Henry Greb, the Harry Greb we know and love. He was born in 1894. In 1899, when Greb was 5 years old a brother was born. Harry. He died 12 days later. There was no older brother that Greb looked up to etc. Greb likely did take his brothers name in the ring but instead of just going along with a bull**** story that you admit hasnt been verified why not verify it yourself? Thats your job.

Page 8 he goes into a long story about Greb's entry into boxing. Stating that in 1913 he was working at Westinghouse (he wasnt) and that he hooked up with George Engel and went to New York and boxed 30 some fights amateur? None of this is true. As a postscript he offers that it might not be true but why not check the story yourself? Its easy to cross reference Engel's movements at the time and even some of Grebs and see this story was false. Engel was managing middleweight champion Frank Klaus at the time and they were in Paris with Engel's stable when this supposedly took place. Lazy.

Page 9 he goes into a long story about Greb's first pro fight which he says was against KO Kirkwood on the undercard of Gibbons-Perry. This was not Greb's first pro fight. It was his third pro fight. A comprehensive cross check of the local Pittsburgh papers supports this. The first two bouts arent easy to find but they are there. Youd just have to work a little to find them.

Page 25 he discusses a party after Greb's fight with KO Baker and says that Mildred Reilly, who would become Greb's wife years later was there as his girlfriend. No. The girl they referred as the "belle of little washington" was not Mildred. Thats entirely an invention of the author. Mildred would have been 14 years old at the time and didnt live in Washington, PA. Never did as far as I know. Greb didnt meet his future wife until about a year before they got married which would have been two or three years after this event. Again, just a lazy author tying loose threads together to make a nice narrative. In discussing Grebs next fight he makes the comment that Grebs "best girl" was there and adds "it was believed to be Mildred" and that this could have been the first fight she saw in person. The only person who believed it was Mildred was this author.

Page 59: He is confused by who Greb fought at the Inter-Allied Tournament, was it Green or Baker? Well gee, rather than say "whoever it was, he was from South Africa" which is literally how he resolves that question. Why not just get a first hand account of the tournament and settle the matter. It was Lance Corporal E.C. Baker.

All of the above is not only lazy but totally disrespects the reader. He obviously still had questions about Greb's life and he simply passed those questions on to the reader. As a reader I buy a biography to have my questions answered, not to have them regurgitated back to me.

I could continue but the point is it isnt hard to flip through it and find large and small factual errors that not only change the Greb narrative but also call into question just how much the author actually knew about his subject or how hard he worked to get the answers to the questions that linger throughout. Its not uncommon to find examples like "its been rumored" "its unverified" "it is believed" etc. If you found a rumor its your job to verify it before you print it! Ive said before and I will say again. When you take the responsibility upon yourself to write a book about another mans life then you also bare the responsibility of getting the story right. You better know that mans life better than anyone else or you arent going to do him justice.
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Thanks for taking time and effort to post this. Will get your book before xmas

he grant · Sep 15, 2018

scribbs said: ↑

Yes it's serious as considering spending 30+ quid equivalent to 40+ bucks. Only use forums for genuine reasons as I have more interests than just boxing so would be pointless to wind people up for no reason, that's what my real life mates are for
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OK. No offense meant. You're new, many folks here play games with alts
(Shout Out to the SPESH and fanboys at GATEWAY !!!) and one of the authors can be a legendary *****. That said , a terrific work is a terrific work.

Have you looked at the extensive reviews for both on Amazon as well ?

Mendoza · Sep 15, 2018

Which book sold more copies?

klompton2 · Sep 15, 2018

PeterD said: ↑

I am a bit of a collector and own both books but haven't read the Paxton book as yet. Klompton's book was a classic of classics in my collection to be honest, loved it and it is one big book filled with photos and information.

I am assuming it will be the only book he will ever write (would love to be wrong) and if so, it is one to be proud of.
Click to expand...

It wont be my only book.

scribbs · Sep 15, 2018

he grant said: ↑

OK. No offense meant. You're new, many folks here play games with alts
(Shout Out to the SPESH and fanboys at GATEWAY !!!) and one of the authors can be a legendary *****. That said , a terrific work is a terrific work.

Have you looked at the extensive reviews for both on Amazon as well ?
Click to expand...

Nah, no offence taken - been scribbs on all forums I have joined apart from crib73 on boxrec but cannot get on that one now. Joined ages ago but had 2 to 3 years away from boxing in general and unfortunately got rid of a shed load of mags and books thinking I was done with the sport but did keep a couple and Paxton's was one of them, Pollack's Marvin Hart being the other.

Yeah read reviews of Compton's and pretty pointless with Paxton's as got the book. Just remember reading a post somewhere on these boards stating it was not a great book compared to Compton's so sought some clarification and views.

I know Klompton2 can get into debates, not my scene as just like to get info and interpret and absorb according to my liking

Not sure who SPESH is or what Gateway is either.

robert ungurean · Sep 15, 2018

I'm a big book guy. I've only owned Paxtons book so I can't comment on both. That being said I bought Paxtons book when it first came out as the only thing befor it was Give him to the Angels.
Needless to say I gave it away within a year.

he grant · Sep 15, 2018

robert ungurean said: ↑

I'm a big book guy. I've only owned Paxtons book so I can't comment on both. That being said I bought Paxtons book when it first came out as the only thing befor it was Give him to the Angels.
Needless to say I gave it away within a year.
Click to expand...

Paxton's book is good. Not ripping it. Any of these undertakings need to be commended . That said, Klompton's Greb is filled with massive research and photos in a similar model to Adam Pollock's excellent Sullivan, Corbett, Fitzsimmons, Jeffries, Hart, Burns and Johnson books. They are not only to read but to reread as outstanding reference books. Chris LaForce's Joe Choynski book is similar and equally outstanding. It's almost a different category and I find them all serious labors of love that serious boxing guys should devour. Then you have weasels like Spe-h!!! who do nothing but wiggle , LOLOL ;P

Chuck1052 · Sep 15, 2018

Steve Compton's biography of Harry Greb is vastly superior compared to the one written by Bill Paxton. The amount of research that Compton did on Greb is staggering. John Ochs also did a huge amount of research before writing his massive three-volume biography of Jack Hurley, a tremendous all-around boxing man. Both Compton's biography of Greb and Ochs' biography of Hurley should be on the short-list of books on boxing history.

- Chuck Johnston

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Compton Vs Paxton Greb Books

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Compton Vs Paxton Greb Books

louis54 Well-Known Member Full Member

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he grant Historian/Film Maker

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