Contemporary evaluations of Rocky Marciano

Actually, from what I've read, that seems to be about the pace Marciano used for his actual 3-6 mile roadwork. Seems like there was a lot of walking and jogging at a leisurely pace, with occasional sprints. If he ever did sixteen miles, he probably walked most of them, at a slower pace than that. I still haven't seen a single credible neutral source that mentions him doing anything like that though, even once, even though I've seen a bunch of writeups on his training for different fights during his reign. It seems most likely that his PR person's account was a whopper.

 

Yeah, I haven't seen anything remotely consistent with any of this.

And the stories that I've seen all have him tapering down as his fights got closer.

 

Regarding Marciano's training I recall reading Angelo Dundee's account of Goldman making Rocky do squats (body weight) as he worked the heavybag. I only mention it because Angie was quite impressed by this. Basically Marciano would do a squat and come out of it punching the bag. Over and over. Dundee saw a few fighters and it stood out enough for him to mention it 40 years later.

 

I have posted first hand contemporary accounts of his training several times. I'm sure he was very focused and intense during his training but the volume was not excessive. A few miles of running, a bit of gym work and a bit of conditioning. Lots of napping and some good eating.

Here is an example of his preparation for Ezz...

Following details are culled from an article by Pete Couros who hung with Marciano during his camp before the second Charles fight. This was printed in the Omaha Herald on June 13 but took place at least one month before.

7AM - 6 miles run completed in over an hour. (That is pretty damn slow for folks who don't know.)

Hot tea, 5 eggs, dry cereal, lamb chops, toasted rolls

With that tortuous work out of the way, Time to nap until 3PM!

The next takes place over one hour:

5 minutes shadowboxing.
3 rounds sparring, 1 round with a different partner.
Heavybag work

Eat Some Steak!

Ping-Pong with Charley!

TV time!

9:30... Time for more sleep.

 

If anyone's interested in a little fake news on Marciano's actual training regimens:




EDIT: "Rocky Marciano Opens Training," Spokesman-Review, July 2, 1952


"The Brockton belter said he weighed 194 pounds and that he had been doing 10 miles of roadwork a day for the last three weeks and had been strengthening his arms by throwing heavy stones and rocks."





"Rex Layne Tapering Off for Bout with Marciano," Morning News, July 10, 1951:

“Rocky Marciano took the day off from boxing at his training camp today, did six miles of road work...”







EDIT: Jack Hand, "Marciano, Matthews Clash" San Francisco Examiner, July 28, 1952:

"Marciano did two miles of roadwork today."






"Rocky Starts Tapering Off," Boston Globe, September 15, 1952:

"Goldman explained that the challenger’s road work also would be cut down to three miles every other morning, instead of his previous four miles each morning.”




Harold Kaese, “In a Game That’s Noted for Its Punks, Phoneys, Rocky Stands for Class, Boston Globe, Sept. 20, 1952:

Colombo’s revelation that Marciano does not eat eight lamb chops for breakfast but only two or three was sworn to by Alfred Renault, the camp’s chef. […]

Marciano, who only skipped rope today, said he was not nervous, “only a little tense like I always am before a fight.” This he admitted, was his big opportunity and concluded, “I don’t intend to lose it.”

Each day for a month, Marciano has got up at 7 a.m. He then has a cup of tea (sugar and lemon) and usually runs between three and five miles.

At 8:30, it is a breakfast of fruit, cereal, two soft-boiled eggs, lamb chops, toast, and more tea.

He walks and naps until noon, when he has some tea.

Then he naps until his big workout at 3 p.m. After 4:30 he naps until dinner time at 5:30; after which he walks, plays ping pong, reads, or listens to the radio. At 8:30 he may have an apple or pear, and goes to bed.

According to Reinault, the meat is usually steak or roast beef—rare. Lamb, veal, and a little chicken for variety. Baked potatoes, green vegetables, and plenty of salads with oil and vinegar dressing. Oh yes—tea.

No Italian foods. No pork. No pastry. No ice cream.

Reinault, who came to this country from Germany in 1923, also cooked here for Joey Maxim before the Robinson fight. The difference he said, was “Maxim had to lose weight, so he ate less and ran more than this fellow.”






“Confidence High in Rocky’s Camp,” Richmond Times-Dispatch, March 15, 1953:

“A typical Marciano training day goes something like this:

6 A.M.—Rocky’s asleep.

7 A.M.—Rocky’s still asleep.

8 A/M/--Finally awake, he turns out in the chill morning air, eating two oranges, ready for five miles of roadwork with his assistant trainer and buddy, Al Columbo. They walk and run, usually running when the road rises.

10:30A.M.—Breakfast before a crackling fire. It consists of two glasses of orange juice, two bowls of oatmeal, three soft-boiled eggs and a broiled lamb chop. (The next time Rocky eats is at supper at 5:30).

He takes a Rest

11 A.M. to 2 P.M.—He rests, reading or just lounging around the small but colorful cottage provided for him by a local firm.

3 P.M.—Takes his afternoon workout in the gym. This is the high spot of the day. The people in this tulip town can see Rocky work every day except Monday and Friday for $1.50 each.

Rocky starts sparring anywhere from three to six rounds depending on how much actual combat Goldman thinks he needs. Then he works on the 160-pound and 60-pound bags and winds up with speed work on the light overhead bag. One day he tore this one loose with a smashing right.

5:30 P.M.—Supper, consisting of light soup, beef stew, boiled potatoes, stringbeans, lettuce and tomatoes, jello and tea.

6:30 to 9:30—More relaxation, writing to home, watching television or movies.

9:30 P.M.—A glass of milk or an apple and lights out, or dream about April.






EDIT: "Rocky Resumes Training Today," Holland Evening Sentinel, May 7, 1953
"The champ was scheduled to do about six miles of roadwork this morning."






Frank Mastro, "Rocky's Ready; Sees K.O. in 8th," Chicago Tribune, May 15, 1953:

“After Marciano returned from five miles of roadwork yesterday morning to conclude preparations, Al Weill, his manager, said: “Rocky’s ready.”





EDIT: "Rocky Works Hard for June Bout!," Dayton Daily News, April 4, 1954
"Marciano did seven miles of roadwork"





Jack Cuddy, "Trainer Denies Rocky Overtrained; Claims Champ is a Superman," News-Herald, June 7, 1954:

“It’s a pleasure to train Rocky because he gets a pleasure out of training. Six miles on the road every morning. From four to six rounds of sparring in the afternoon. And more than an hour of gymnasium exercises after the sparring.”

Goldman: “Rocky thrives on exercise like a fish on water, and he sleeps about 15 hours a day—including forenoon and afternoon naps, and he’s a big eater.”




Jimmy Breslin, "Rocky Still Has Faults, But Hurts You With Every Punch," Marshfield News Herald, June 14, 1954:

“His daily routine calls for five miles and he follows it, jogging along the hilly roads which surround this huge resort. Every 15 minutes or so, Rocky will cut down his stride and begin firing punches into the morning air, snorting, and growling.”




EDIT: "Heavy Workout for Rocky Marciano," Globe-Gazette, Feb. 22, 1955:
"Rocky Marciano turned in seven miles of road work and then sparred four rounds Monday at his training camp. It was his sharpest workout since he defended his heavyweight title against Ezzard Charles last autumn."




"Rocky Picks Early Hour for Running," Austin American, August 4, 1955:

“Heavyweight champion Rocky Marciano arose early and did six or seven miles of roadwork Wednesday before the sun became too hot.

He then boxed three slowed-down rounds against his spar mate, Felix Antonio of Dayton, Ohio. Marciano continued to work out at a relaxed tempo, fearful that he might lose too much weight by overworking in the intense heat.”




"The Lineup by Joe Custer," Honolulu Star-Bulletin, Sept. 14, 1955:

“Marciano: A Champion’s Training Schedule
SLEEP—Nine hours every night, without fail (to bed by 9:30, “even if his best friend arrives at 9:28,” and up at 6:30). Naps in mid-morning (following roadwork); during the noon hour (skips lunch); also in mid-afternoon.

DIET—Breakfast: concoction of cornflakes mixed with two raw eggs, blueberries and vitamin pills, two lamb chops, hot tea. Dinner: soul, green salad, two steaks (but nothing resembling rich spaghetti and lasagna, which he loves).
…
WORKOUTS—Roadwork in morning, 5-6 miles…gymnasium in the afternoon—heavy and light bag-punching, sparring, calisthenics, rope-skipping, shadow-boxing.




Indianapolis Star, September 20, 1955:
Had a picture with Marciano doing roadwork standing next to his trainer Allie Colombo who was holding a football that he brings along to break up the monotony of the run.




EDIT: Jack Cuddy, "Rocky Still Favored 4-1 Over Moore in Title Match," Alexandria Daily Town Talk, September 21, 1955
"Tuesday Rocky did two miles of roadwork in Bronx Park."





Retrospective:

EDIT: Denny Boyd, "They Were Brothers in Combat," Vancouver Sun, Sept. 2, 1969:

[interview with long-time sparring partner, Dave Davey]
"Up at his training camp, he and I would go out in the morning and do four or five miles road-work. I'd be bushed and so would he but he'd force himself to do another mile."

 

I didn't know monks slept and played ping pong so much.

 

I don't think the fact that Ben Bentley was his press representative, is a good reason to dismiss his testimony out of hand, especially if it was given after the time.

I would be very surprised if he did not reduce his mileage as the fight got closer, as to do otherwise would be counterproductive.

If I run a marathon, I cut my mileage right down two weeks before the event.

If I do a 100 miler, I start cutting it about three weeks before the event.

Regardless of the truth of the testimony, it has had a considerable impact.

Rocky Marciano's training regimes regularly appear in men's health magazines, that are nothing to do with boxing!

 

I didn't dismiss it out of hand. I examined all of the available contemporaneous accounts of Marciano's training, and noticed that not a single one leant any support to the Marciano training myth first (see above). They were especially incompatible with the claim that Marciano ramped up his running as the fight drew near, running 15 miles per day the week of his fights. The stories that I found demonstrated the exact opposite, and none had him regularly running anywhere near 15 miles per day at any point in his training.

Why should we believe that story? It seems pretty implausible in light of the existing evidence.

I'm not even sure Bentley ever even said these things in the first place. Where did he actually share that story? I can't find any direct, credible sources. It would be a real shame if he got dragged into this nonsense by some anonymous Internet liar.

 

What we would expect, is that Marciano would have started his training camp at relatively low mileage, say 3-6 miles. That is the bread and butter of most endurance sports.

We would then expect him to gradually increase it, peaking lets say a couple of weeks before the event, then scale it back gradually.

No runner is ever going to do a high mileage run the week before a marathon, because it would just trash their body, and harm their performance.

Runners call this phase "the taper", and it really screws with your head.

The term "taper madness" would be familiar to any runner.

I imagine that what Bentley was referring to, was the point when Marciano's mileage peaked, which would have been at least a couple of weeks before the fight.

 

The substantially revised version of the Marciano training story that you just imagined up certainly would be more plausible than the actual existing version that gets attributed to Bentley.

But why should we believe any of it? The existing evidence is pretty consistent and offers no support for any of it.

I'm not even sure Bentley ever even said these things in the first place. Do you know where Bentley actually share that story? I can't find any direct, credible sources.

 

It went viral long before the internet was a significant factor!

 

I don't see how it is substantially revised.

I merely speculated upon how it would have happened, and I don't think that my speculation is incompatible with Bentley's claims.

It is like with any other primary evidence.

You either accept it or dismiss it, but it has still reached the level of primary evidence.

If that is the holy grail, then I will look for it, but it will make everybody's life very difficult, if everything is held up to that level of scrutiny!

 

Seriously? As you know, his (alleged) claim involves Marciano increasing his running during his camps to the point where he was running 15 miles per day the week of his fights. In the version that you just imagined, Marciano peaks weeks earlier than Bentley claimed, tapering down the week of his fights instead of ramping up. Very different narrative. Your version is less absurd on its face than the Bentley version, and less directly contradicted by the evidence that I've produced.

It's not even really primary evidence at this point, as nobody seems to know when or where Bentley allegedly made this representation. As far as I'm concerned, it's nothing but gossip.

On the other hand, we have actual primary evidence that consistently tells a very different story about Marciano's training.

Considering that some of us have produced several pieces of evidence that directly undermine the story, I would think that anyone at all interested in getting to the truth of the matter would want to see the best sources available!

I still wouldn't be inclined to believe Marciano's press agent against the weight of all of the other publicly available contemporaneous accounts, but it would be a huge step in the right direction.

 

I don't know why Rockistas are so intent on convincing the rest of us he ran 16miles a day , if he had done that on a regular basis.[equivalent to more than a half marathon,] I would have to say Goldman was a ****ing idiot,and that we know he was not that !

 

Ali was photographed training underwater throwing punches. Press agent fakery he couldn't even swim!