Could Ezzard Charles, on performance enhancing drugs, equal Holyfield's record?

When he caught that shot from Jersey Joe anyone would have gone down for now and keep in mind you’d already had 75+ flights. I don’t think his chin was frankly that bad.

 

No one can argue that! Wait! I forgot where I am..... that is a hard one to argue!

 

I'd definitely give him a better chance to do so.

 

EVANDER HOLYFIELD
WHERE DOES HIS CHIN BELONG IN THE PANTHEON OF GREAT HEAVYWEIGHT CHINS?
NOT AMONG THE BEST IF ONE IS OBJECTIVE ABOUT IT

 

No way someone Marciano messed up is going to match Holyfields performance with Lennox. Im not having it.

 

I am unfamiliar with this pantheon, I can tell you to the chicken fried rice is overrated at Chin’s Palace.

I don’t like putting to fine of a point on this type of discussion. It seems pointless and frankly the moderator here who fancies himself as an intellectual is an disrespectful punk and does his best to dumb the level of discussion down to “glass mandibles” so I disdain for the topic.

However, I will say that someone who stood up to, and withstood Foreman, Tyson, Lewis, Holmes, Qwai, Rahman, and Mercer to name a few so he is welcome into my pantheon.

 

Holyfield's chin is superb. Tyson never overly bothered him in two fights, he went a good 24 rounds with Lewis and comfortably took blows from Foreman that knocked others out. The Bowe fight was an outlier and all the champs get hurt or dropped at different times.

 

Agreed on the chin.

I ponder whether we know that Holyfield’s chin is so great because at times he fought so recklessly and had to show his chin was great?

Against Bowe, abandoning his boxing and deciding to trade with the bigger man, going left hook happy. Not utilising his excellent double jab as much as he should have and relying on his chin to get him closer to his man and wear him down. Perhaps, Ezzard’s tendency to box after the Baroudi fight stands him in better position to avoid the situations where Evan had to prove just how good his chin was over the course of a career?

Perhaps, roided up Charles develops the neck and trap musculature to withstand heavier blows and with increases in strength, power, size and arguably speed is actually a much more potent fighter than I have allowed myself to hypothesise?

The more that I think about it the more that I could see this hypothetical fighter absolutely dominating the 90s. He would still likely suffer one or two knock outs as I would imagine him to take on a younger Lewis, go through a better series with Bowe, face a more focused Tyson and not have the biting scenario as he wouldn’t be head butting like Evan did - it’s a very interesting proposition, actually.

 

It's certainly an interesting scenario. He's one of the greatest ever and thumping on 25 pounds of usable weight would be fascinating. He is shorter than Holyfield with less reach too as well.

 

The discussion was merely the point that even if Charles was roided up like Evan, he wouldn’t have Evan’s chin - so can we assume that he survives the fights that Evan did based on his superior skill set but inferior chin?

 

Less reach and shorter but better two handed arsenal, slicker movement and better defensive attributes - also his ability to time his counters should still get him close enough to box with the slower jabbers and movers that Holyfield faced.

I would pay to see this hypothetical Charles against Bowe. The clash of styles and size could make for the greatest trilogy.

 

To be fair, I later raised the possibility that he would develop the trap and neck musculature to increase his resistance to the big shots.

I think Holyfield demonstrated a better chin than Charles over his career.

I am open to the scenario where a roided Charles takes a much better shot than the one that Jersey Joe starched him with and retains his defensive ability.

 

Yeah he would get a better chin but his equally roided up opponents would get bigger punches too....

Charles would do very well.

He doesn't beat Tyson or Lewis.


He doesn't beat Bowe because even if he roids up enough to hurt Bowe, we have seen that hurting Bowe doesn't earn his respect, he keeps coming which means Charles gets bullied and worn down in a way where his skills are rendered almost meaningless.

He could beat Holyfield(Styles)


He beats everyone else that Holyfield Beat, Foreman would really give him trouble but I favor Charles.


Tall mobile Ruddock and Tucker would beat him because Charles didn't have the right styles but Holyfield didn't fight them.