Could Fritzi Zivic @ his best

Good heavens, I'm sitting here drinking beer and talking boxing, not about to go and do research. I don't know of five Mayweather opponents that would fight LaMotta tough, give Robinson hell, and beat Armstrong 2/3.

 

I thought you had some names in mind already, where he fought at long range. Ok.

I don't think Mayweather's best opponents would be losing to guys like Kenny LaSalle, Johnny Barbara, Tony Motisi, Reuben Shank, Norman Rubio, Sheik Rangel, etc.

 

Not off the top of my head. but since we are checking boxrec...
Barbara went 2-2 with Zivic. LaSalle went the distance with archie moore, burley and the cocoa kid twice, while going 2-1 vs zivic. Shank went the distance twice with Apostoli, was 2-1 vs Zivic, and beat henry armstrong. Rubio split with Zivic, went 8 with Robinson and the distance twice with freddy cochrane. Rangel went the route with Apostoli and Armstrong.
I think that those guys fought better guys than mayweather. It seems to me that those guys, every one of them, fought tough guys and held their own, for the most part. Certainly, every one of them has fought better guys than Mayweather, and they didn't fight them once a year.

 

It is frankly quite stupid to try to compare the guys Mayweather has fought with the guys Fritzie Zivic fought.

 

S'you shoot at names that have no meaning to modern boxing fans...These guys were much more experienced, fought in a much more competitive age than today...If I could use an analogy in baseball. Most of today's alphabet fighters would be in the baseball minor league teams, waiting if ever, to get good enough to play in the major leagues where they would be competitive to
mix with most of the guys you disparage above....Of course there are exceptions with some of todays "part time" fighters as Mayweather, Golovnik,
who Mayweather would not ever challenge, and a very few others...To you , experience fighting in an era when there were maybe 5 or more times pro fighters, fighting at least monthly in hundreds of fight clubs, trained by full time boxing trainers against all styles ,mastering the art of infighting, is not advantageous in spawning a better crop of boxers such as the 1940s for example, why is there a FOUR year college course rather than one or two years required to absorb more information and knowledge ? Fighting often as the old timers did against other "been through the mill" fighters, separates the wheat from the chaff,as they say...

 

Burt, I live in surreal New England, where the

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just won their third World Series Championship within a decade.:scaredas: What kind of analogy would you apply to THAT spooky reality?:think

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[Me, I'm thinking about driving over to Salem, Massachusetts today to find out what kind of witch's spell has been cast to cause this to happen. Might they also tattoo pentagrams and runes on Mayweather's chest and body to protect him from Fritzie as well? Salem, Massachusetts on Halloween is the one place in the region which might be weirder than the Fenway today, although Provincetown can be counted on for year round weirdness.]

 

Burt, I did see reports of several bouts of the fighters I listed and they were nothing special. I have a feeling that Zivic suffered more losses against in-fighters who simply outslugged him than to boxers who outboxed and outjabbed him.

 

Castillo anything special? Because he beat Mayweather. You bring up Corrales which was a great looking win for Mayweather but what nobody ever mentions, because nobody who wasnt at the weigh would know, is that Corrales failed to make weight, was dead at the weigh in, and paid Mayweather under the table to go on with the fight because he needed a payday before going to prison. Thats a fact, it just got swept under the rug just like DLH not making weight for Corley and Gatti not making weight for Gamache (which I saw with my own eyes). When you are the money fighter you can get a lot of advantages bent in your favor. How would Floyd's record look fighting 70 years ago once a week without a pampered HBO contract, extremely careful matchmaking, home court advantages, etc. My guess that "0" on his record changes to an "OH!" coming out of his mouth everytime he has to face someone who actually knows that you concentrate on pressure and volume against a conservative defensive fighter instead of trying to outbox him because you are "bigger." Old time fighters had enough schooling and experience to do that. Today's fighters who might have a handful of fights against legit threats by the end of their careers cant compete with the kind of experience that fighters like Zivic brought to the table fighting top fighters on a regular basis. Alvarez was considered this massive threat to Mayweather and he had what one or two fights against legitimate top threats... maybe. Then people are shocked when he gets taken to school. Theres one born every minute but I wouldnt be shocked if Zivic took Mayweather to school and tore him a new *******.

 

There were enough fighters in history who were showing their class from the start, beating all those fighters who fought every week, and doing so very easily. If somebody thinks a hypothetical Lew Wickwar would be able to beat young Mayweather, because he had 400+ fights, that's their problem, sorry.

 

I attribute the Boston Red Sox winning the World Series after 95 years to "the spell of the Bambino's curse", has been cast away, and a great management front office...I am [pardon the expression] a NY Met fan but the Red Sox have a great team...I am one of a few still kicking who saw Teddy Ball Game, play at Yankee Stadium...The greatest hitter in my lifetime, fallowed by Stan Musial. Now back to boxing A...:good

 

S, who ever said that Len Wickwar would have beat Floyd Mayweather? I have posted that there are exceptional fighters today as Mayweather is but he would not be unbeaten today if he fought about every 3 weeks or so with the likes of an Ike Williams, Beau Jack, Sammy Angott, Bob Montgomery to name a few LWs, nor tackling a Ray Robinson, Tommy Bell, Fritzie Zivic, Kid Gavilan, Johnny Bratton, Billy Graham, Emile Griffith, Henry Armstrong, luis Rodriguez ,
Ray Leonard, Tommy Hearns, Roberto Duran etc...He is the best of a mediocre crop of fighters today...No more, no less...

 

My mother was born in Lake Worth Florida, but lived in St. Louis during the war years, where she got to see Ted play as a young girl [including the 1946 World Series and 1948 All Star Game, as well as spring training when she lived in Florida]. Being a baseball fan in that city, of course she watched Stan the Man in action frequently as well. [She eventually drifted away from baseball fanfare, but her father was a hardcore Atlanta Braves fan into the 1990s who was adamant that Hank Aaron should be made their manager.]

During the early 1980s, she was managing the sporting goods section of a now defunct Bradlees Department store in Keene, NH. Ted came through, en route to visit former wife number three Dolores Wettach in Putney, Vermont to retrieve their son John Henry to ferry back to the Northfield Mount Hermon school in Massachusetts. Ted came through Keene all the time to run this errand [and he seemed to be on good terms with his ex], but now, he happened to be in Bradlees right when my mother was, in her department. She quickly grabbed a trio of boxed Little League baseballs, and he cheerfully signed them for her while engaging in leisurely chat.

Here's the best part. As they were both holding one of those baseballs in passing, somebody snapped a candid Polaroid shot of him beaming down at her while she had a boxed baseball in her other hand, with her supervising hard lines manager holding a trio more. Smiles all around. [In contrast to his sometimes tempestuous public image, everybody I know who ran into him around central New England said he was always friendly, relaxed and very easy going.] He's casually wearing khakis, an un-tucked button down patterned shirt, and a white spring jacket over that, with an outline of Florida and his autograph monogrammed over the state outline. He certainly didn't hide who he was when he went out in public.

It's a delightful photograph of just the two of them. [Only her manager's hand holding that trio of baseballs is visible in the main Polaroid we have.] Years later, I had it enlarged as much as possible without loss of clarity, and slipped it into a magnetic refrigerator plastic display pocket. She also has a copy of that moment in her room along with the plastic encased boxed autographed baseballs themselves, a very pleasant memory.

Indeed. Ted would not want us to be diverted on his account from the sport of his friend Joe Louis for long.

 

Says it all.

 

Only one? PBF's new nickname might be "Chocolate Swiss Cheese," or, "The Watering Pitcher," after 15 rounds with Fritzie. [Yeah, Floyd "CSC" or "TWP" Mayweather just might work after the Croat Comet got through with him.]

 

Once again Burt sets the record straight. Mayweather's a great talent for sure but he never met a fighter the likes of a prime Zivic, who himself fought some of the best to ever step inside the squared circle. Those guys are from a different time/era when fighters fought often and against the best around in order to stay in the public eye and climb the ladder to the title. Along the way they honed thier skills and hardened thier bodies along the way. no picking and choosing to pad your record. Fight or fall off the boxing map...period!