Could Holmes Circ 1984 - 85, Have Beaten Wilder?

For the record, Tyson Fury was 6'9" 277 and 273 pounds against Wilder when he beat him.

Tyson Fury is the largest World Heavyweight Champion in boxing history, other than Valuev, who only won the WBA strap.

Yet Fury claimed he felt Wilder gave him brain damage in their third fight. (His behavior since then doesn't exactly discount that.)

Larry Holmes was 6'3" and 221-223 (six inches shorter, 50 to 56 pounds lighter than Fury) in 1984/1985.

I don't think 84/85 Holmes would pose nearly the same problems for Wilder. (I didn't think Larry even beat Carl Williams, who closed Larry's eye.)

 

Wilder has one punch knock out ability. He doesn't perform well taking out a hurt opponent. How many times did a dazed Fury get off the mat? A good finisher would have killed him, but Wilder came in windmilling shots that were easy to avoid.

 

A good finisher would've killed him?

The referee was counting so slowly in their third fight that the round was over by the time Fury got up. You can't walk up and finish a guy between rounds.

This "windmill" nonsense deserves another clip of the slow girl running. I don't even think you guys watch the fights anymore.

Post a clip of Wilder windmilling trying to FINISH a hurt Fury in either their first or third fights.

You must be confusing Wilder with Shavers, who, after he floored Holmes, was throwing telegraphed roundhouse rights that missed by FEET. And that "dancing" Holmes wasn't 1984/85 Holmes.

This content is protected

Again, Larry Holmes was a half a foot shorter and 50+ lighter than the ONLY guy who Wilder couldn't finish. And, when you're outweighed by everyone all the time, it isn't easy to stop everyone.

I think Larry Holmes from the Norton fight or Larry Holmes from the Cooney fight could certainly beat Wilder.

Holmes, IMO, was never sharper than he was those two nights. On the same note, I don't think ANY heavyweight WHO EVER LIVED could've beaten the 277-pound MONSTER that was Tyson Fury the night he beat Wilder in their 2020 rematch.

(I don't even know who that Tyson Fury was. Fury was never that good EVER before that or after.)

Many champions have nights where they are so sharp most others never would've beaten them.

But Larry Holmes from 1984-85 doesn't beat any version of Deontay Wilder since he's been a top 10 fighter. That older, stationary Holmes stands ZERO chance. NONE.

On those few nights when Larry was razor sharp (Norton-Cooney being prime examples) ... he certainly could. But Larry would have to be at the absolute top of his game. And Larry had his own faults, too.

In 1984 and 1985, no way. In 85, I didn't think he beat Carl Williams or Michael Spinks. So he sure as hell isn't beating Deontay Wilder.

Carl "no chin" Williams shuts Larry's eye, goes the distance and appears to win, and light heavy Michael Spinks does go the distance and beats him, but WILDER (of all people) is getting choppped down by that version of Holmes?

No.

 

Much as I HATE to agree with you, I agree their are definitely double standards when it comes to Wilder and Shavers. If Wilder at any point in his career, let alone in his prime lost to, or even went the distance with the likes of Bob ****ing Stallings, we'd never hear the end of it.

 

I don't think even a prime Holmes would have a walk in the park with Wilder. Holmes had a tendency to drop his hand after he jabbed which would leave him open for Wilder's best weapon.

At the very least, Wilder gets a KD imo.

 

I think Holmes outclassing Wilder at that late stage is possible but I’m not sure whether or not he should be favored to do it. Larry was starting to get hit more and more often from 1983-1985 and his weakness for right hands would be a big problem against Wilder

 

I'm a big fan of Holmes but I'm not sure I'd favour the version of Holmes who arguably lost to Williams, and then lost to Spinks twice.

Holmes at this point had no legs and was quite stationary and was ready to be taken, Holmes could also be a sucker for the right hand which is dangerous for a faded Holmes against an genuine 1 punch KO artist.

A prime Holmes utterly bamboozles Wilder and gives him a boxing lesson.

A faded Holmes in 84-85 is a toss up but I'd give the edge to Wilder.

 

My point exactly! If he could finish a guy like Tyson could he would've stopped Fury. There's a difference between instantly stopping someone and breaking them down to get the stoppage and Wilder does the prior.

 

I meant Wilder is not to the level of Tyson when it comes to having the IQ of getting a guy out who needs a few more blows, not that he can't stop ppl. If Wilder gets a guy hurt and they aren't going down easy he'll b more lost than Tyson would. And ur seriously using a shot Tyson? I'm obviously talking about when he was still good enough to contend. There's a difference between being a one shotter like Wilder and someone who knows how to break down opponents like Mike did.

 

I'd pick old Larry Holmes over Deontay

 

You are spot on. Deontay gets the job done well against the average joes but when faced with someone with class, recuperation, heart and skill he's simply failed. To have someone down so many times and not get the chocolates is telling. Of course it also speaks highly of Fury's survival skills as well to be fair. Tyson was a much more explosive finisher who didn't need to end things with one punch. If you were hurt he'd batter you with lightning power packed two handed salvos. If an opponent can resist Wilder tires fast when he lets loose looking for the finish line. Fury was back in control pretty quickly at various times.

 

Holmes was quick and knew how to dance.
Holmes imo.

Lets call it death by a thousand jabs.

 

I'll speak highly of Douglas too for getting up, shaking it off then stopping Tyson as well. Wilder is still not the combination puncher Tyson ever was but tbf not common at heavyweight so credit to Tysons uniqueness.

 

wilder. the idea that he is **** comes from guys who saw him be **** at the start of his pro career and refused to change their view as he got much better.

fury is a ****ing giant with decent skills. horrible matchup for anyone.

 

Holmes controls most the fight, gets floored hard halfway through, gets back in control the next round and ultimately stops Wilder in 12.