Could Joe taste defeat the same as Enzo?...

Who has Kessler beat besides that **** fight with Mundine? Don't say Andrade either, he does not count.

 

Oh yeah, dont mention current WBA champ Mundine or long time top 5 smw Andrade. While you are at it dont mention Beyer, Lucas or Siaca either.

Idiot.

 

Calzaghe is in another class than Enzo. Haye was easy to hit and so was Enzo. Haye will never beat Vlad, no way.

 

That's not an answer to my question. 'Who has he beat'.

Which one of those guys that I listed out should be favoured over HIM at 168 or 175, at the stage when Hopkins fought them?

None.

And Andrade does count, he won every single round. Beat Mundine 9-3 and only lost 2 other rounds between Lucas and Siaca, on top of starching Beyer in 3 rounds. That's a solid resume in an underrated division, then add to the fact that he gave Joe Calzaghe a good competitive fight, something that Taylor, Pavlik, Abraham or any of these other top MW's simply could not do.

Learn how to rate a fighter by way of analysis, not just 'what big names do I recognise as wins'.

 

And he didn't just win, he dominated all of them! Mundine did the best in winning a BIG 3 rounds over Kessler and Mundine's a better fighter than Taylor or Pavlik will ever be, and they just don't get it.

 

YES, yes they do.

Kessler is a good fighter. NOT a great one. Glen Johnson NOW has a chance to beat him...forget the Glen Johnson that fought Hopkins. Taylor also is a rung above Mikkel...we might soon even find out. And Wright....ARE YOU SERIOUS? Also Tarver and Echols would provide a tough night for him (tho I favor Kessler...).

I dont get it. Leading into the Joe fight, we were in agreement (hell, I even predicted EXACTLY how the fight would go about because of how obvious his flaws are). Kessler was a very good, but very limited fighter...now he is some elite fighter??? HOW? By showing he was as one dimensional as we thought going into the Calzaghe fight? By showing his movement and footwork are slow and plodding? By showing his timing isnt good (tho his technique is fantastic)??? By showing he lacks any type of adaptability? I could really go on and on.

How is suddenly the second coming of SRR?!?!!?

This is sad, because I actually think Kessler is a good fighter (and I actually LIKE the guy as well)...but this is getting out of hand...

 

Kessler would beat Wright at this time.

 

Right now? No, but does that mean he is a better overall fighter than Wright? Would I think it would be a cakewalk as well....no. Wright throws ALOT and has fantastic defense...along with a very good chin. He right now would trouble him, but ultimately lose.

 

No and giving Johnson more than a chance to win 3 rounds is just talking out of your ass. Also not recognising that Johnson got better as time went on after the Hopkins fight due to the immense experience he gained traveling about. Johnson was the best at LHW because of his experience, he was terrible at SMW, but now he's just getting too old, even though he's still a GOOD fighter.

The one Hopkins got was undefeated, but look who he was fighting prior to Hopkins, nobody worth **** and I don't just mean 'unrecognisable names', I mean no more than C- level fighters.

Taylor can't even beat Pavlik, Kessler brings the same type of workrate, but with 3-4x the skill level and accuracy, absurd to think Taylor's going to be even competitive.

Vanderpool, Joppy? Solid fighters, sure.

Echols giving Kessler trouble? Again, talking out of your ass.

So the result is that all of those guys I listed would have all they could handle or lose to Anthony Mundine, who Kessler beat 9 rounds to 3 clean, case closed, Hopkins has not beaten a natural MW-LHW as good as Kessler in his entire career.

BUT, I rate being competitive with Jones as BETTER than defeating Mikkel Kessler, so that evens out in my book, the only problem is that we were dealing with a young Hopkins there, the one that hasn't been around since year 2000 essentially.

 

He can't trouble him, because he can't deal with movers as he's now flat footed, Kessler has very good movement and will be beating him to the jab as early as round 1 and will just open up on him with well timed shots, as he has a stationary opponent that can't hurt him.

Don't be blind.

And Wright being a better overall fighter would have validity to his LMW days, not at 160 and above.

 

Ignoring nothing. To even hint that THIS CURRENT version of Johnson is better than the MW version is insane. Plus, Johnson is the type of fighter who is in your chest all fight, throwing with good power and as you eluded to is incredibly smart. The younger one had a better workrate and power....giving him 3 rounds at the least is talking out YOUR ass.

True, but his work afterwards shows that he wasnt a flash in the pants fighter. He was, is and always has been a tough fight for EVERYONE and ANYONE. His style is just what Kessler has problems with (look what Joe was able to do by keeping the fight inside and away from Kessler's strengths...).

Pavlik has about 10x the power Kessler has. You and I both know this...It was Kelly's power that was the main factor in the Taylor fights (and with you hatred to anything Jermain, I dont expect a clear look at this from you).

Plus, this is just more fighter A beats fighter B bull****. Just because one fighter beats one fighter, doesnt mean a fighter that fights NOTHING like the winning fighter will beat the other just because "he is better". Hell if thats the case....McBride beat Tyson, Tyson beat Berbeck, Berbeck beat Ali....so Mcbride DEFINATELY beats Ali.

atsch

Didnt say they would win....

The Echols that Hopkins fought (as opposed to the one that fought a few weeks back) was a physical BULL. He roughed you up on the inside. Dirty as hell as well (dirtier than ANYONE Kessler has fought). Threw in bunches...WITH POWER (more power than Kessler...or anyone Kessler has fought for that matter). And had a beard....and THAT GUY DOESNT STAND A CHANCE AGAINST KESSLER????

And your telling me your not overrating the guy (obviously to build up Joe's resume)?

Fighter A - fighter B **** again...Am your better than that. And again, I dont think Mundine beats them as easy as you say (some not at all...MOST not at all in fact). Your WHOLE arguement is subjective.

If you think that young Hopkins is better than older Hopkins, then I just dont even know what to say....Hopkins wasnt even close to his prime when he fought Roy (neither was Jones for the record)...Hell, Id pick THIS Hopkins over THAT Hopkins H2H.

In fact, that gives me a GREAT idea for a post....:yep

 

Kessler has very good movement now? Since when?

:huh

 

I can't see Kessler having any problems with Wright at this stage of their careers. At the same time, I don't see how you can begin to compare Wright's career in its entirety to what Kessler has acheived thus far. Which means that I have no interest in using a faded Wright as some kind of measuring stick for Kessler's greatness.

When he starts systematically cleaning out 168 the way Hopkins did 160 in the 90's, a task he is more than capable of achieving, I'll be the first to start calling him a great fighter. Until then he's a good fighter with a lot to prove.

 

So you are comparing Calzaghe to Maccarinelli based on nationality or skin color?

 

atsch