Could Lennox lewis handle Ali's speed?

Defeating 1967 Ali takes a particular set of assets. I would say that most of those assets are not part of the Lewis repertoire. Ali had more trouble punching down than up. Crouchers and crabbers confused him. Head movement threw off his timing and exposed his open windows. I think that short and strong swarmers were the potential foil for prime Ali and Frazier seemed to prove it.

Lennox, as I see it, would be dominated over 15 rounds. He has no head movement, he's fairly stand-up. He is not dynamic. He is not known for being a pressure fighter. How is he going to disrupt Ali's rythym? He isn't. In fact, I don't see any of Lennox's assets making the difference between his losing and winning.

He's tall, but the usual height advantage isn't playing here -Ali was 6'3 himself. He's physically strong. But then so wasn't Liston and Foreman. He has a good jab -but it isn't fast enough and often was pawing. He could punch like hell, but we all know that isn't going to mean much here.

Those who are choosing Lewis aren't really saying why. What is it that he is bringing that is going to make the difference?

I think that what rekcutnevets has already stated as Lewis' "coordination problems" will be costly here. Lewis was a puncher who at times went straight for his man and that was what got him his biggest wins -Ruddock, Golota... that would fail miserably against Ali who will dance away and at angles like a matador. Lennox was also quite content to fight deliberately, if not carefully. And that is more likely to happen here. And that is precisely how not to fight Ali. Lennox would not look good in this one.

...Ali would tag him "Lummox Lewis" -and then prove it.

 

50/50 match. Ali technical flaws could cost him in this fight. Lewis is a better all around boxer than Ali was, which should not be confused with " faster "

Lewis could jab, cross, hook or uppercut well, and unlike Ali he was a good in-fighter.

Both men had a lot of pride and ring smarts. I think Ali out smarted Foreman, and psyched out Liston. He could not defeat Lennox Lewis the way he beat Foreman or Liston.

The 66-67’ Ali could win, but he’s going to need one of his better nights to decision Lewis.

 

Know what else is right there for all to see? Lewis taking on every big puncher of the era and going down a grand total of twice.

 

There's a lot of reasons why either fighter could win. Ali had primarly speed and smarts, but some of his technical abilities were suspect. Specifically he kept his hand low and he tended to go straight back when pressured, both are no-no's when you're in the ring with an elite fighter. Nor do I recall Ali being particularly good on the inside..I don't recall an upper cut that wobbled anyone for example. Now if one follows Lewis throughout his career what you'd notice..is two things. One is as he aged he became a better boxer, and secondly, he slowed down a lot his late 20's to late 30's. He was actually quite fast when he was fighting Ruddock, Gotola etc. Fast and devastating. Never as fast as Ali mind you, but certainly more devastating. I'm still convinced a focused Lewis would give Ali all kinds of trouble..and although he may not win, cause it would a close call as to who would, he certainly had the arsenal and technical abilities to seriously hurt Ali, and perhaps take him out. He's got almost as much power as Foreman but he's a lot smarter and technically better fighter, than Foreman ever was. That's a formitable combination, even for Ali, and if he backs up to get out of range of a punch, he may just end up setting himself up for Lewis' overhand right. Can't say for sure it would happen, but it's certainly plausible.

As for punching power and an ability to take a punch, while I wouldn't bet on the outcome of this fight, I would bet that if there was a knock out, it would be Lewis who would be delivering it, not Ali.

 

I just can't see it that way.

Keep in mind that Ali in Zaire was about 7 years past his best fight and was coping with a soft ring. While Lennox could be effectively explosive from the first bell, I don't see him as formidable as Foreman.

You have a nodding head here when you speak of Ali's "technical shortcomings" but we have to be real careful about overemphasizing that. This is a savant we are discussing here and perhaps the greatest "athlete" of anyone ever in the ring north of 147.

When Ali became complete in 66-67, he wasn't an in-fighter but he had no reason to be -no one could cope with the mobility, the excellent and unheard of ability to find range and measure incoming shots to the millimeter, and his extraordinary timing and coordination. Saying that Lennox may catch 1967 Ali as he pulls back from a punch would be nothing less than far-fetched if you emphasized it any further. Ali's coordination and reflexes were simply too good, and Lennox' reaction time was simply not good enough. I see Ali nailing him hard and often with straight shots. He's too fast and he's got size, reach, and strength of his own to stay safe.

And why would Ali want to fight the larger, stronger Lennox inside? It would be not only counterproductive, but counterintuitive given Ali's superiority outside against the comparatively uncoordinated, basic, and deliberate Lewis.

I see it as more likely that Lewis gets stopped. Remember that this is going 15 rounds and Lewis was never known for keeping a pace that even approaches Ali's. Lugging 245 pounds around catching butterflies is going to invite serious fatigue and it's not like prime Ali will let him rest without eating bees.

A KO of prime Ali is highly, highly unlikely.

 

Ditto. Well put. I would put my money on Lewis if gun put to my head.

 

I'm surprised by the amount of ignorance when it comes to a famous boxer like Ali. Ali had a complete set of punches, he could throw them textbook, but many times preferred a more homemade technique. He didn't throw uppercuts or hooks often because he liked to fight at distance, but if you look at some of the uppercuts and hooks he lands in the first five rounds in FOTC and in the rematch against Quarry you will see that he definitely had that in his arsenal. He was a poor infighter? Tell that to the Frazier that faced him in Manilla.

Anyway, this would matter little, because, as Stonehands say, he would keep at a distance. And something that is often not mentioned when it comes to Ali is his outstanding timing. This, along with his speed, helped him to reach his opponents with his punches before the reach him. Even if they had the better reach.

I will concede that Ali bent too much at the waist when he ducked. Otherwise his technique was unorthodox, not flawed.

 

What ignorance? Ali did several thing wrong. He rested or was caught on the ropes too often; he had a low guard, often pulled straight back ( which worked for Ali because he was generally taller and quicker than his opponents ), had a slapping type of hook, next to no body punching, and hardly used an uppercut. Ali was a great out fighter, but not much of an in fighter.

Ali was able to reel in a smaller and weaker Frazier by clinching him behind the head ( Illegal and should have lost points ) , but this is not an option vs a much bigger and stronger Lewis.

Ali also had trouble with the jab at all stages of his career…Jones, Norton, Lyle, Young, and as a shot older fighter vs Holmes. In fact, Jones, Norton, Lyle and Young collectively out pointed Ali! Lewis had a great jab too, and based on Ali’s fundamental flaws and trouble with this punch, he’d land it on Ali. Unlike the other guys, Lewis was an all time puncher.

Ali could win, but he is going to have to out speed Lewis by using his feet in a boring type of match, and maintain his stamina for the duration. If Ali gets lazy, or tires to out slug Lewis, Ali is going to lose. If you ask me, Lewis is a better boxer than anyone Ali faced.

50/50 in a prime vs prime best night type of match is what I say, but if they fought slightly past their primes, I'd pick Lewis.

 

Same old cliched bull****. :rofl:rofl:rofl

 

Let's face it, most boxing debates are. :hey

 

I think this would be a tough fight.

Lewis certainly had his flaws, but one of his greatest assets was his brain. He would not fall for following Ali around like a puppy on a leash like so many of Ali's opponents in the 60's did.

Just something to ponder...

 

IMO, Stonehands89 made the best case out of anyone.
(And yes I am Aware that I have an Ali Avatar, makes no difference)

Let's not also forget that Ali in his early days had some "Pop"
Up until the fight with Liston Clay was 19-0-15 K.O.
Up until the Exile and fight fight with Fraizer Ali was 31-0-25 K.O.
(Defo would not be Lennox fortay to take to many of those punches)

 

Sounds like someone is trying to make friends with Zakman!