Could Sonny Liston have made it undefeated vs Louis title defenses?

?

 

If he wasn't a good fighter what does that say about the rated men he beat such as
Folley
Machen
Jones
Chuvalo ?
They must have been crap too!

 

Did Willie even fight Jack in a 10-15rder? No? Otherwise I’m not interested, in those days 4 rounders and other short distance fights were treated like hard spars and exhibitions if it wasn’t at the “building” stage of a fighter… things were taken less serious, Zivic was as good as the best of his era but would take “dives” against local hero’s etc.

 

Break it down McVey don’t hide… BUT I don’t think any of those fighters are overly good either, for contenders Terrell, Chuvalo, Machen etc they’re just decent - good pros nothing special… what would they be rated in the 80s-90s I wonder?

 

Ellis hit hard enough to floor Bonavena twice.

 

I think Ellis hit hard but to “assist” here Griffith dropped D1ck Tiger… @BoxingFan2002 so it’s not always a sign of the capacity to swat, a good punch is sometimes just a good punch.

 

Oh I see,so you're going to ignore the fact that Dempsey failed to beat Meehan in 3 out of 5 fights ? It counts, matter how short the distance.
Ok how about Dempsey,in reality, losing to Luis Firpo ?

 

Spelling man,just check your spelling !

 

So you think close to amateur distance fights 4 rounders? Should matter… okay, I guess it makes him not look very good at 4 rounders? - last time I checked the defanged version of Dempsey that had the title beat Firpo? That fight was whacky Dempsey was WWE slammed onto a type writer right? so some weird stuff happened and the result was the result… Before we go further know that Dempsey himself thinks after he won the title he was ruined as a fighter… I tend to agree with him he was 4 years past his best and doing sweet F all the entire time he was champ, exhibitions, plays, getting into panic shape but mostly just F-ing around in Hollywood… JD was a sucky champion and his whole reign felt like smoke and mirrors… what he did against Sharkey was very impressive doe, look at the time off he had and his result compared to say Robinson during his famous upset against the Tiger.

 

Why didn't Macho Camacho do anything to win in his fight with the Golden Boy? Why did Ernie go into a defensive shell in his fight with Muhammad Ali? Did Oscar and Muhammad have anything to do with it? Was it serendipity?

 

Forget the number of rounds.The fact is Dempsey consistently failed against an opponent who wouldn't be good enough to be a sparring partner for either Liston or Foreman.
' WWE ' slammed ? I don't know where you get that from.He was PUNCHED out of the ring,and with considerable help from the ringside reporters just about beat the TWENTY second count.
No matter what the circumstances,no matter what the context that is what happened.
An ATG in reality lost to an extremely crude slugger.This drives home my point that even
ATGs can lose to inferior fighters under the right circumstances.

 

Last I checked JD won, weird… yes Meehan beat Dempsey in 4 rd’ers it’s a great achievement init? Dempsey better hope he never has to face the likes of a Big Toney in a 4rder…

 

My posts are often ridiculous.

Your spacing and punctuation are irregular.

We all have our crosses to bear.

 

Why does Ken Norton's and Oscar Bonavena's attributes have everything to do with Ali looking bad (He did go 3-1 against them) and Muhammad Ali's attributes have nothing to do with Ernie Terrell locking awful? Could it be speed, reflexes, and grit have a quality of their own?

 

You could probably resolve that by doing a technical dive into any fights Terrell had against contenders who weren't Ali. See whether his ability to keep fights at a distance was any better.