David Tua versus Jim Corbett

This is a decent response I would change just one word the underlined and replace it with for.

 

Well, fighting someone who you significantly outweigh is easy because when you punch them they move. Against someone who weights more, you'll get winded a lot faster. It's the difference between shadow boxing and punching a wall.


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Hey, I picked Tua as well... but height and physique don't really mean a whole lot in boxing. Height means a little something, so does reach. Size matters a good bit. Muscles? Not really! Look at John Ruiz, James Toney, Tyson Fury, and some others.

Nostalgia is a hard thing to overcome. I'm not saying newer is better but take away the nostalgia factor, pretend these oldtimers did what the did in a more modern era... would it be as impressive?

Sullivan, Corbett, Fitzsimmons, Jeffries, Hart, and Burns? They were either small or smallish HWs (with the exception of Jeffries). Size matters. Jeffries wasn't small but his opponents were, he really didn't prove he could beat a big and talented HW. Most of the fighters who were big back in those days were very limited, they were downright clumsy to be honest. Sullivan was very crude. Fitzsimmons was a SMW. Burns was 5'7" and a SMW/LHW. Known of these guys would beat David Tua. Tua took shlts bigger than Burns or Fitzsimmons.

Who beat a prime or near prime Tua?

Ibeabuchi won a close decision vs. Tua. They went toe to toe for 12 round, throwing and landing a lot of punches. I doubt any of them could have accomplished something like that.

Lewis was capable of beating just about any HW on his best night, this was Lewis at his best. Lewis clearly won by decision but couldn't hurt Tua despite landing many clean punches. Not many fighters who ever fought Lewis can say that.

Byrd won a somewhat close decision. 115-113 maybe even a 116-112 score for Byrd. Byrd was slick southpaw who was fast, elusive, accurate, and very durable. He's also 6'2" with a 74" reach and was 215 Lbs. when he fought Tua.

That's it.

Tua stopped WBA HW Champ Ruiz in 19 seconds and Lineal HW Champ Moorer in 30. He stopped Lineal HW Rahman in the 10th round and their rematch was a draw. Rahman had his moments but couldn't get a win vs. Tua. He also stopped WBC HW Champ Oleg Maskaev in the 11th round. He stopped Fres Oquendo in the 9th round, WBA CW Champ Robert Daniels in the 3rd round, Obed Sullivan in the 1st, Gary Bell in the 1st, Nate Tubbs in the 2nd, David Izon in the 12th, Darroll Wilson in the 1st, Cecil Coffee in the 1st, and Danell Nicholson in the 6th.

 

Watch David Izon on film and tell me honestly that Corbett looks better , more skilled?

 

Tua would never find Prime Corbett over a 12-15 round distance. Too quick, too much movement.

 

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I made a bet with myself your first excuse would be:

" We don't have full records for the era".

The spurious argument that probably only those against name fighters is exploded when we look at the names and records of these opponents .you're not clutching at straws here, you're trying to pick up jelly with a pin.
We have the words of Jim Corbett to Tommy Loughran referring to how many fights he had.
We have the exhaustive research done by Adam Pollack for his Sullivan,Corbett, and Fitzsimmons books.

Corbett was outboxing novices, and bareknucklers who were used to LPR rules.

They weren't small heavyweights ,they weren't even small light heavies,they were super middles, and many of them nobodies with a handful of fights under their tubby belts.

The most talented boxer Corbett fought was slightly past prime and nursing an ankle injury, he wasn't out boxed , he held Corbett to a draw.


At least 4 of Corbett's opponents were under 170lbs!
The era in which McCaffrey and Mitchell operated is the most p*ss poor one ever.
No amount of obfuscation on your part will ever change that.
Ask yourself honestly ,would McCaffrey ,Goddard,Kilrain or Mitchell be rated in the top ten in the 1990's?
Would you pick ANY of them to beat:
Fres Oquendo,David Izon,JohnRuiz?
I never thought to say this to you J , but you are embarrassing yourself here.

 

Even if we assume that Corbett’s record is complete, it is highly unlikely that his opponent’s records are complete.

Determining the actual records of B and C tier fighters of that era would be virtually impossible.

Again you can’t assume that they were weak contenders simply because they were small.

They might have been pound for pound phenomenons.

I would say that holding Jackson to a draw was no mean feat.

He might have been the best heavyweight between Sullivan and Jeffries.

You don’t need to obfuscate something that is already obscure.

I don’t honestly know whether they would beat them, but I certainly wouldn’t assume that these novice versions of these fighters would beat top contenders from another era.

That would seem to be a little rash.

 

I would say you're done.
No offence J, I like your stuff ,but you're off base big time here. Let's agree to disagree?

 

Great post

 

Honestly,just comparing resumes I don't think I would rank Corbett higher.

Corbett has Choynski,tua has ruiz. Corbett has Sullivan, tua has moorer. Corbett has jackson, tua has rahman.

And Tua just has more. It's 52 wins vs 11. I'm sure Corbett has one fights we don't know about but that's asking us to rank him based on something theoretical.

 

Choynski was a novice. Sullivan was a dissipated alcoholic who hadn't fought in 4 and a half years!

 

That's kinda my point. Tua beat some elite heavyweights at various points in their career and so did Corbett. But I think Tua beat more of them.