David Tua vs Jim Jeffries

Oh yes, sparring stories. I've heard so many amazing sparring stories... I don't think it's reasonable to base opinions about such stories to be honest, but to each of your own. Corbett was unable to outbox Sharkey for what it's worth.

Are you sure you know HW history that well?

Floyd Patterson defended his title against amateur Rademacher.
Tommy Burns defended his title against Jim O'Brien who has no reported fights before or after.
Your beloved Jack Johson fought Tony Ross, whose results in the last 8 fights before the Johnson fight was 1-4-3.
The greatest Muhammad Ali defended his title against amateur Leon Spinks... and he lost the fight.

You don't seem to have that much problem with those choices as with the former champion Jim Corbett who came out of retirement at the age of 33 to contest the title. I don't understand why to be honest, if you claim to be objective on Jeffries.

 

Maybe the reason Corbett was not able to out box Sharkey was because he wasnt actually that good! What is his best win? The OBien go was an exhibition with Burns taking on 2 men on the same night,and You don't think I know boxing history? Rademacher was the Olympic champion and had been active he wasn't some has been retread .Had Ross not won a fight for NINE AND A HALF YEARS? Spinks was the number NINE ranked heavyweight when he fought Ali.Wipe your face,its got egg on it!lol

 

If you want to argue that Corbett wasn't that good to begin with - that's another conversation. Start a thread if you think so, I'd probably agree to some degree with you - Corbett is often overrated.

So it's better to defend against Rademacher who never fought professional fight or Ross who was a nobody and lost most of his fights before the defense? Is it better to defend against a nobody like Leon Spinks (and lose against him) than a former 33 years old HW champion who came out of retirement to contend on the title?

It's the same thing with Tyson vs Holmes - just because you don't rate this win high, it doesn't mean that everybody agrees with you. I give you a proof that a lot of people value this Tyson win and I'm sure most would take it over Rademacher or Leon Spinks.

It seems that you have a certain criteria that has to be followed, otherwise you have to attack people with different interpretiations of facts or different criteria of evaluating fighters. I'm not going to follow this debate forever, you keep repeating the same thing over and over, I presented my statement about Corbett fight a long time ago. You can disagree, but stop acting like your opinion is the only right one.

 

The reason Corbett could not outbox Sharkey was because Sharkey made you fight at all times! He didn't care if he was hit. His best wins are probably Choysnki, Goddard ( when he head something left ), McCoy, Corbett, and Rulhin. He fought the all, including Jeffries and Fitzsimmons so we should know where to place him.

 

I've already told you Spinks was the 9th rated heavyweight.

 

Based on what accomplishment exactly?

 

Ask the Ring magazine.What accomplishments would you say Corbett's two title challenges were based on exactly?
The fact that he had beaten a 165lbs man 6 years earlier?

 

You could argue that Jeffries didn't need to give Corbett his first shot at the title, but he had to give him the second, based on his showing in the first fight alone.

 

If that were the case,and it wasn't, the obvious answer would be , why did it take Jeffries over 3 years to give Corbett the rematch?
Now I've demolished that deliberate detour, I'm engaging no further with you on this subject, going around in circles just makes me dizzy!

 

I'm asking you, since you implied that Leon Spinks was more credible challenger than Corbett.

The first one is quite clear - he was the former HW champion of the world who wanted to come back and challenge the title. He probably shouldn't have got the chance right away, but don't act like it's surprising thing that has never happened before or since - former champions always get higher respect and strong support.

The second one was made because of Jim's good showing in the first fight, as well as the strong win against McCoy after. You can argue that the rematch happened too late, but Jeffries had to defend his title against other credible opponents and unlike other champions of that time, he was active and took a lot of challenges.

 

For the benefit of those who are engaging with me, Jeffries injured his arm in the Corbett fight, which forced him to take eighteen months out of the ring.

On his return to the ring he took a couple of tune up fights, to make sure that the arm was OK.

By the time he was defending against the top contenders again, Fitsimmons and Ruhlin also had strong claims to a title shot.

 

After the KD Fitz, already in a very bad way, did fight back somewhat but Corbett was still throwing and landing also - which you haven’t described and Corbett wasn’t stopped in his tracks by Fitz’’s efforts - Corbett was still pursing til rds end. Corbett was off his toes by that stage, tried to finish it and was that much more tired for his efforts. Just as an FYI, Corbett also claimed that Fitz was given a long count - 15 secs?


Not dismissing out of hand the punches Fitz did land throughout the fight BUT the overriding fact was that Corbett began to visibly tire after rd 6 (read: lack of match fitness, especially so after shooting his load trying to put Fitz out) and was fatiguing badly by rd 10. Naturally that lent itself to Fitz being able to slowly but surely establish himself which he was unable to begin doing in any notable way prior to rd 7. Ultimately, whatever accumulative effect Fitz’s body work had, it was still a right on the money, single body shot that ended it.


Again, Corbett‘s premature tiring was none too surprising given his acute inactivity going into the fight. It was equivalent to a retired fighter staging a comeback after several years hiatus - the odds always being against same.


See how same aged, 1 fight in 5 years inactive Ray Leonard began to tire in his own right by the mid way point of a 12 rd’r allowing Hagler to peg his way back into the fight. A few more rds beyond 12 and an extremely fatigued Ray may very well have been put out.

 

Just want to add: the clip provided is a very nicely cleaned up version as compared to other uploads.

When checking old newspaper articles online some time back, an article from an Australian newspaper dated either 1897 or 1898 reported the fight film being shown there and circulated throughout the country.

When looking for old films, do they check far and wide (not just the US) for copies that were obviously distributed further a field?

Btw, one article re Corbett v Fitz referred to Ruby Robert as New Zealand’s Bob Fitzsimmons. The UK, Australia and the US might have something to say about that.

They could divvy up Bob’s World Titles I guess but he wasn’t considerate enough to win 4.

 

Janitor as he often does ,has come up with a pitiful excuse.If Corbett gota rematch because he was beating Jeffries before walking into one when he tired why didnt Jeffries give him an immediate rematch,why wait over 3 years to do so?
You know this is a dishonest excuse yet you use it? That's rather a shame actually.