De la Hoya- would he be considered an ATG if he had retired after Mayorga?

DLH will NEVER be an ATG.

He is a sure fire first ballot HOFer but he has lost too many of his big fights to be an ATG.

Fighting the best means nothing if you do not beat them.

The Trinidad fight was off set by the Sturm robbery.

 

Waht big fights are you talking about?

A VERY close one to mayweather? (past his prime)

BEaten by Pac (Weightdrained/Past his prime)

A VERY close one in Mosley2

A competitive one in mosley1?

 

Agreed. Except for Camacho. He didnt really matter at that point

 

I always view DLH as a lower weights fighter too. One reason why I do consider him an ATG. The whole DLH doesn't deserve ATG status cuz he lost too much I'd say you can say the same thing for most fighters at the end of their careers. I do think the Tito fight ****ed him up mentally and I do think he should have stayed with Alcazar as his trainer. The Alcazar/Hoya team was a ****en great thing to watch. :good

 

Thanks for once again ducking my questions. The reason that you are doing that, is because you have absolutely nothing to back up your statements. Which is why you want to turn this into a pointless debate about my opinions on Oscar's controversial fights. My opinion on his controversial fights has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to due with how Oscar will go down as an ATG. Either get with the debate, or just admit that you have nothing to offer.:good

 

i asked my question before yours so don't come back with this ****, this is very sad and i expected more from you answer my question and i will be happy to answer yours. I don't duck questions but as i said before i have no inclination to answer a question from someone that ignores a basic question i asked them. You give me an answer and you will get one back.

 

What a joke. Embarrassing. So.. you won't discuss the topic of Oscar's ATG status... unless we pointlessly argue about controversial fights?:-(

To answer your question, so hopefully you will move on... I don't believe that Oscar lost ANY of the decisions that he was awarded. He definitely pulled out the Quartey fight with a great 12th round. He landed DOUBLE the power punches that Whitaker landed... and he simply outworked Sturm. You can disagree... I honestly don't care. I don't need his robbery losses to prove my point, and I don't even care what anyone's opinion is on Oscar's fights with Whitaker, Quartey, or Sturm.

Let's move on now... go ahead and provide some actual information to back up your stance. I would love for you to answer the question about Duran, and I would love for you to show me that top 80 ATG list that you obviously have.

 

Anyway:

1 - Sugar Ray Robinson
2 - Henry Armstrong
3 - Sam Langford
4 - Hary Greb
5 - Ezzard Charles
6 - Willie Pep
7 - Mickey Walker
8 - Archie Moore
9 - Roberto Duran
10 - Bob Fitzimmons
11 – Joe Louis
12 - Charley Burley
13 - Benny Leonard
14 - Muhammad Ali
15 - Sugar Ray Leonard
16 - Barney Ross
17 - Sandy Saddler
18 - Joe Gans
19 - Gene Tunney
20 - Jimmy Wilde
21 - Pernell Whitaker
22 - Carlos Monzon
23 - Barbados Joe Walcott
24 - Stanley Ketchel
25 - Tony Canzoneri
26 - Julio Cesar Chavez
27 – Eder Jofre
28 - Salvador Sanchez
29 - Jimmy McLarnin
30 - Jack Britton
31 - George Dixon
32 - Evander Hollyfield
33 - Terry McGovern
34 - Ted "Kid" Lewis
35 - Roy Jones Junior
36 - Ruben Olivares
37 - Thomas Hearns
38 - Alexis Arguello
39 - Wilfredo Gomez
40 - Jose Napoles
41 - Ike Williams
42 - Manny Pacquiao
43 - NonParallel Jack Dempsey
44 - Billy Conn
45 - Marvin Hagler
46 - Lennox Lewis
47 - Carlos Ortiz
48 - Holman Williams
49 – Kid Gavilan
50 - Micheal Spinks
51 – Floyd Mayweather
52 - Ricardo Lopez
53 - Pancho Villa
54 - Azumah Nelson
55 - Emile Grifith
56 - Abe Atell
57 - Wilfred Benitez
58 - Jack Dillon
59 - Fighting Harada
60 - Carmen Basillo
61 – Bob Foster
62 - Kid McCoy
63 - Aaron Pryor
64 - Jimmy Bivins
65 - Joe Frazier
66 - Les Darcy
67 - Manuel Ortiz
68 - Tommy Loughran
69 - Jim Driscoll
70 - Jack Johnson
71 - Joe Walcott
72 - Bernard Hopkins
73 - Fritzie Zivic
74 - Carlos Zarate
75 – Oscar De La Hoya
76 - Kid Chocoloate
77 - Jim Jeffries
78 - Eric Morales
79 - Rocky Marciano
80 - Marco Antonio Barrera

 

Some surprising names ahead of Oscar on that list, IMO. Given Oscar's achievements against their's, and considering who Oscar beat, along with just watching film on the fighters... ect... Especially considering that Oscar beat two of your top 26 ATG fighters and took their titles from them. However, I won't attack your list. I am impressed that you posted one.:good

 

In regards to oscar getting the titles from the two guys i aint going to lie and say they were shot but honestly prime for prime i don't think oscar gets anywhere near beating them

 

I obviously disagree... but that's how it goes.:good

 

Even if you believe that Sturm beat Oscar, it sure as hell doesn't offset his fight against Tito. An older Oscar, moving up to 160 pounds and fighting doesn't mean anything compared to undefeated prime Oscar vs Undefeated Prime Tito... in a robbery that totally changed Oscar as a fighter, and he was never the same afterwards.

So, I guess that Duran is also definitely not an ATG, right? He lost too many big fights, didn't he?

 

Agreed on all counts.