Definitely fixed fights?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, Feb 5, 2022.

  1. Guru88

    Guru88 Active Member Full Member

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    Liston’s dive against Ali was probably the most blatant one I’ve ever seen. First of all he had strong mob connections, that’s always a start. Liston had a solid chin and Ali wasn’t a puncher, he hit Liston with a right hand which wouldn’t knock a granny out, Ali’s feet were barely even planted. Look at how Liston reacts on the floor, he thinks about getting up and then starts rolling around, then he realises how bad it looks, gets up and the ref stops it. Then he dies a few years later after he starts talking to people about the dive, I mean come on. It was so obvious that it was a dive, so so obvious.
     
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  2. rinsj

    rinsj Active Member Full Member

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    Big George was so passive in that fight. I remember watching it when it first aired and kept thinking "why is George not making an effort?".
     
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  3. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    In a later interview George (who admittedly said some crazy S) stated that if viewers knew how many fights were fixed they would stop watching.
     
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  4. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Do you have the link to that? Or the cite where we could find it?
     
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  5. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Temple shot and he got up and kept fighting.
     
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  6. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    He did get up and continue fighting .
     
  7. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    A bunch of fights out of Africa and poverty level parts of South America. I'd imagine Southern Asia too, but I'm not up on that.
     
  8. johnmaff36

    johnmaff36 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Thanx Stevie G. I dont dip my toe in as much but this Classic forum is the only one i go to when i do. A lot of sharp guys here whose knowledge is amongst the best ive ever came across. Hope alls well with you mate
     
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  9. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    All good at this end thanks.
     
  10. turpinr

    turpinr Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The main reason I think the second Ali-Liston is a fix is that Ali knew he hadn't hit him hard to knock him down.
    Ali was screaming at Liston to get up.All the experts, ie ex fighters including George Chuvalo knew it was a dive.
    A few of them later changed their minds but I think boxing had such a bad reputation at the time, they were told to retract their statements
    When you land a ko punch you can feel it up your arm and into the shoulder like an orgasm.
    I watched a documentary on Ali recently and Michael Bentt pointed out all the writhing round Liston was doing and called it 'bad acting'
    Joe Louis and Ray Robinson carried some of their opponents and I reckon Jersey Joe Walcott had to go into the tank a few times.Some of the fighters he lost to when he was younger, shouldn't have been sharing the ring with him.
     
  11. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT Full Member

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    I think there were too many other contributing factors isolated from Liston himself to suggest a fix. For one thing, Walcott didn’t even administer a count before waving it off upon Fleischer’s advice.

    Ali was delayed in retreating to a neutral corner which consequently should’ve delayed the start of the count anyway.

    Ali screams at Liston to get up, allegedly concerned that the audience will perceive a “fix” but then Ali himself begins a preemptive victory lap even before 10 secs had elapsed since Liston hit the canvas.

    Sonny finally arose when the coast was clear to fight on then good ol’ Jersey “I missed the count vs Marciano” Joe Walcott waves it off.

    If Liston did deliberately take a dive, it was amazing that he had such an “unwitting” cast in perfect support.

    There were multiple culpable parties involved in Lewiston but when the smoke cleared many found it too easy to point to Liston as the sole culprit.

    Due to past “misdemeanours”, Sonny presented as the ultimate “fall guy”.

    Too bad the original fight date didn’t come off - Sonny was moody, focused and trained to the second - ready to land in the ring at a very well conditioned 212 lbs.

    Not to say Liston would’ve won but it would likely have been better than what went down in Maine.
     
  12. Storm-Chaser

    Storm-Chaser Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Foreman vs Briggs was blatantly rigged. I suppose this was done because it would be a bit of an embarrassment to the sport of boxing to have a 48 year old heavyweight champion of the world successfully defending his title for an extended period of time.

    Round 1: 10-10 Even
    Round 2: 10-9 Foreman
    Round 3: 10-9 Foreman
    Round 4: 10-8 Foreman
    Round 5: 10-8 Foreman
    Round 6: 10-10 Even
    Round 7: 10-9 Foreman
    Round 8: 10-8 Foreman
    Round 9: 10-9 Foreman
    Round 10: 10-10 Even
    Round 11: 10-9 Foreman
    Round 12: 10-9 Foreman

    Total Points:
    120 vs 108

    Punches through Round 7
    Foreman accuracy: 59%
    Briggs accuracy: 43%
     
  13. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    He was certainly not the Foreman we're used to in that fight.
    It looked like age had finally caught up with him, but of course he went on to win the title after this fight even, so who knows?
     
  14. salsanchezfan

    salsanchezfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I too think that one was a fix, for the same reason Bentt does. The way Liston rolled around on the canvas was deplorable acting. That isn't how one responds when struggling to get up from a knockdown. That fight was rather obviously tanked. Not sure if it was pre-arranged or Liston just decided against it at the last second, but he absolutely threw it.
     
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  15. turpinr

    turpinr Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Right from the bell Liston was over his front foot inviting a punch, any punch, so he could lie down.
    Ali knew straight away Liston had gone into the tank.
     
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