1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Demetrious Johnson the GOAT

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by DougTheThug, Apr 16, 2017.



  1. DougTheThug

    DougTheThug Member Full Member

    131
    64
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 19, 2017
    No they're not. DJ has foughe the best of the best. They even made an ultimate fighter just to find someone that might be able to beat him
     
  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    They had Pride GP to find someone who might beat Fedor.

    Name any wins that come remotely close to Big Nog.
     
  3. DougTheThug

    DougTheThug Member Full Member

    131
    64
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 19, 2017
    The problem with that is the Flyweight division is underrated. The top 10 contenders arent bad at all, its just Demetrious Johnson is a humble God
     
  4. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    Name anyone who's as good as Rodrigo Nogueira on DJ's ledger.
     
  5. Birmingham

    Birmingham Active Member Full Member

    521
    205
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 13, 2017
    This. when Fedor was prime he fought the best there was..Beat the best the world had to offer in pride ! I know couture wanted the fight, but I remember back when it was being talked about, Fedor would of wrecked him imo
     
  6. ellerbe

    ellerbe ESB's Most Unbiased Poster Full Member

    22,168
    938
    Sportsbook:
    500
    Jul 25, 2014
    I really like Fedor, he fought in Japan(where I grew up and live), and I've watched him growing up. He has great wins, but as for a H2H standing it's hard to put him up there because of him going like 1-3 in strikeforce where the competition was obviously better. You could make an argument that Fedor was "shot", but I just think the competition caught on. He was great for his era though, and damn that fight with cro-cop was great.
     
  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    Was it better though?

    Is Werdum better than Nog?
    Is Silva better than CroCop?
    Is Henderson better than Randlemann?

    I don't think the the comp caught up that much. He was 34 when he went to Strikeforce.

    I mean h2h speaking who could be top 1-3 HW? Cain and Dos Santos don't look unbeatable any more. Werdum has always had his demons. Miocic is still a bit of a variable. Overeem is inconsistent.

    In MMA no one is uneatable.
     
    DougTheThug and UnleashtheFURY like this.
  8. UnleashtheFURY

    UnleashtheFURY Boxing Junkie Full Member

    41,774
    3,580
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Sep 29, 2012
    The Pride HW division was the absolute best at the time. The whole 'better competition' line has been repeated to death and refuted many times by simple logic like Luf just did. Usually parroted by casual WWE kiddies who bought into all of the ridiculous Brock and 'new breed' fighter hype. There's absolutely no one Fedor lost to in Strikeforce that he wouldn't have been favored to beat in his prime. Bigfoot? Glass jawed and inconsistent fighter who Fedor easily steamrolls in a minute or two at his best, Hendo? Smaller wrestler with a good chin and right hand. Fedor dealt with bigger, more powerful wrestlers and elite strikers. Werdum? See the Nog fights for how Fedor would have dealt with him in his prime.. Of all the Strikeforce fighters it's Cormier who would pose the most threat to a prime Fedor.
     
  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    Also beating a BJJ guy in UFC or Strikeforce which favours wrestling is one thing, but beating a BJJ guy in Pride which favours BJJ guys (submission attempts are scored just as dangerous as strikes) is even more impressive.

    If he can dominate Nog he can dominate Werdum.
     
  10. ellerbe

    ellerbe ESB's Most Unbiased Poster Full Member

    22,168
    938
    Sportsbook:
    500
    Jul 25, 2014
    Don't buy it. I'm not a huge MMA buff, but I think the UFC, and strikeforce were on a different level than him. You say in his "prime", but Fedor was 33 when he lost. He wasn't shot to ****. Fedor was overrated imo, you can cry and say that "only casuals and WWE kiddies, and how it's repeated to death", but I can respond with pettiness and say only Fedor nutriders would say otherwise, and the same thing you said is repeated to death on youtube videos etc. I mean Werdum is like 40 and Stipe are 35 ffs. Cormier is 40. Not saying Fedor was in his prime still, but it's a total cop out imo.

    Fedor is one of the most overrated MMA fighters h2h imo. And this is a guy I grew up watching. If he was in today's UFC, I'd favor Stipe, Cain, Werdum, all of those over him quite easily.
     
  11. ellerbe

    ellerbe ESB's Most Unbiased Poster Full Member

    22,168
    938
    Sportsbook:
    500
    Jul 25, 2014
    100% no one is unbeatable. But the fact that Fedor lost like 3 fights in a row and won 1 strikeforce fight speaks volumes. In his prime if he fought in the UFC now I don't think he would have been even close to as dominant. I'd actually favor Cain, Werdum, Miocic, etc over him. I'd favor him over Overeem though.
     
  12. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    In his prime did you see the state of UFC HW division?

    Sylvia won a handful of nobody fights before beating Ricco. Mir won a handful of nobody fights before beating Sylvia.

    Former failed contender Arlovski then beat Sylvia for the belt when Mir retired, Sylvia won a return against Arlovski.

    Out of those men, Mir lost to every striker he faced. Arlovski and Sylvia both lost to Fedor. Who else is there?

    After Sylvia came Couture, the man who was outmuscled against Barnett and Rizzo. None of whom have a ground game close to Fedors.

    After Couture came Lesnar, now he maybe has a chance due to his strength, it could be argued he has a chance against anyone, but he still got tapped out by Mir and battered by Cain. Even if he pins Fedor to the mat, who is he gonna escape the armbar attempts?

    After Lesnar comes Cain, JDS, Werdum and Miocic. Maybe the first two beat him, but they're considered by most to be amongst the very elite MMA fighters in history. Werdum is a lesser version of Nog, without his chin, Fedor beats him in his prime. Maybe Miocic beats everyone in his prime, or maybe he gets sparked by JDS in his next defence.

    So who is there in UFC to beat him? The first man you could pick is Lesnar and by then his Pride run has ended and he still goes down as the most dominant HW in history.
     
  13. ellerbe

    ellerbe ESB's Most Unbiased Poster Full Member

    22,168
    938
    Sportsbook:
    500
    Jul 25, 2014
    Also UTF, let's not try and pretend like Fedor being in or out of his prime had ANYTHING to do with his loss over Werdum. Werdum baited the **** outta of him and beat him with strategy. If you can't see this, then you are what I will admit I am myself, a casual. I don't blame to be an MMA expert, but I know enough about combat sports to understand what happened during that fight. I started off watching k1 way before boxing, I grew up on it, it was huge in Japan. CroCop and Fedor are legends to me. But when Fedor stepped up to the plate and the real big leagues, he went 1 and 3. Those are facts. Now I never watch the Henderson fight so I can't comment on it, but he lost against Werdum through strategy, and Werdum superior jiu jitsu skills.

    To me the best h2h of all time has to be either Jon Jones, or GSP. Now I'll be honest I haven't seen all of these guys fights, only a few, but on paper it speaks volumes. At the highest league look at what they've done and beat. As for mighty mouse, to me he's kind of like GGG, again I've seen him only fight once or twice though, but he's fighting midgets that no one has heard of, so rating him h2h so highly is ****ing stupid imo. What he's doing is kinda similar to what Rousey is doing, he's dominating a division where there is just not a lot of talent.
     
  14. ellerbe

    ellerbe ESB's Most Unbiased Poster Full Member

    22,168
    938
    Sportsbook:
    500
    Jul 25, 2014
    When I said in his prime, I'm comparing it to THIS era. I understand that when he was in his prime the UFC sucked. If I'm not correct even a shot to **** 50 year old Mercer beat a former UFC champ.

    Werdum would have beat him regardless. If you are a MMA buff you should admit that Fedor lost due to strategy, and mind games. Not because he was "out of his prime". I also think Miocic would have beat him, though anything can happen. I'm a big Fedor fan than these guys, I grew up UFC ffs, but this is how I see **** playing out.
     
  15. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

    58,857
    1,265
    Sportsbook:
    1,182
    Sep 15, 2009
    Overeem, JDS and Arlovski all had enough to beat Werdum, i don't see a way that you can be so convinced Fedor fails were those 3 succeeded.

    Miocic is too unknown at this stage, as i said he might lose ko1 to JDS then lose by submission to Werdum and then ko1 to Overeem and before you know it his career is over before it began.

    Fedor ruled through the most competitive HW era there had ever been.