Dempsey a thief claims Ez's Camp !!!

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by he grant, Mar 18, 2012.


  1. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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  2. Stonehands89

    Stonehands89 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I mentioned that in "Just Watch Mah Smoke" in the part about Jannazzo-Cocoa Kid I, where Dempsey cast the deciding vote against Cocoa Kid.
    Both The Baltimore Sun and the AP had Cocoa Kid ahead 7-4 and 7-5.

    Dempsey's subtle and not-so subtle preference for white fighters after he retired is unnerving. Even Arcel, a big fan of his, went ballistic when he did Ezzard that injustice.
     
  3. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    Dempsey is a racist by any measure of the word. He gave the decision to a white fighter over a black fighter. We all know that is impossible.

    And even in a world where such an occurrence were possible, the only possible motivation for such a decision would be RACISM! It's the reason why the sky is blue, the angels sing and birds fly. It makes us rise and toil and kneel in supplication. It's the very energy which whirls the electrons round the nucleus, binding and unleashing the powers of the universe as it choses...
     
  4. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    I would not want any single person to decide a verdict in a bout let alone a Mormon ref deciding on a Mormon fighter in a Mormon town ... definitely wish I could see the whole fight ... does it exist and if so has anyone seen it ?
     
  5. Stonehands89

    Stonehands89 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    -You got me all wrong, sport. I'm a big fan of Dempsey, but not so much of a fan that I can't see the shadows.

    One or two bad decisions in favor of white over black isn't enough. But when you're researching other things and statements and patterns that you aren't even looking for keep cropping up, you get unnerved. That is, unless you are such a reactionary to the loony left that you're ready to grab an axe to swat a fly.
     
  6. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I actually prefer that all my heroes are racists. At least I don't have to do the tedious examinations of their every statement and action to brand them with the Scarlet R. It just makes life a lot easier for me.
     
  7. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    S, if I comprehend your post correctly, I agree with your assumption. I have heard Dempsey was not as good a referee as wished after he retired. But for example in the last 3 or so TV bouts the decisions were horrendous.
    Simply horrendous. Are we then to apply the cause of the judges BAD decisions,based on "racism" or more aptly, because of incompetence or
    home town decisions, favoring their potential cash cows...For an example
    I could cite the fight between Ray Robinson and Artie Levine in 1946
    when Robinson was dropped by the heavy handed Artie Levine...Robby was HURT badly but the referee in Cleveland instead of starting the count
    right away, WALKED Artie Levine to a neutral corner, THEN walked back to the prostate Robinson, and THEN started the one count, giving Robinson an estimated 17 seconds to clear his head before he got off the canvas...So
    it was obvious that the fantastic drawing card Robby was swayed the referee to do what he did, and not because of "racist " reasons...Money counted then, and it still counts now...Dempsey I have read was a referee because of his name, and not because of his referee skills. As was the referee Jersey Joe Walcott, who was bewildered in the Liston/Ali fight...
    P.S. I am sure there are biased officials, as there are prejudiced
    citizens, but I think that Dempsey most likely thought that Rex Layne won the decision over Charles in Utah in 1952, OR was swayed by the fact that Rex Layne was a hero in his home area...Just my opinion...
    Home town decision...
     
  8. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    That's technically the rules Burt
     
  9. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    It seems championship boxers made really bad ref's. Dempsey and Walcott come to mind. Do you know how Leonard was?

    Anyways, home cooking doesn't always mean racism... tho everything in this day and age seems to mean racism. It's just a mighty damning accusation to toss around.
     
  10. Stonehands89

    Stonehands89 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    No one called him a racist here, Seamus.
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Apparently Dempsey paid for his long time sparring partner's,[ George Godfrey's ,]funeral. I don't know if he accompanied the eulogy with the words ,"the only good n****r, is a dead n****r".
     
  12. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    PP, the "rules' call for the referee to direct the fighter to a neutral corner
    and then start the one count...Not to WALK Artie Levine to a neutral corner and THEN walk back to Robinson,and then start the count...Cannot you see the difference PP ? As I have posted before, this "long count" was discussed very much in Stillman's gym when I was there not long after that fight...PP , you lose a decision this time !:good
     
  13. Stonehands89

    Stonehands89 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He also supplemented their income by hiring them as sparring partners when he was champion.
     
  14. edward morbius

    edward morbius Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hardly unbiased observers, though.

    Nat Fleischer scored the fight 5-5 in the Ring Magazine article on the fight.

    Jack Hurley scored the fight 6-4 for Layne.

    Along with Dempsey, these are probably the three most respected neutral boxing observers, and none scored the fight for Charles.

    *I would like more info, but off the best evidence, it appears to have been a close one, not an outright robbery.
     
  15. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    All I can remember of Benny Leonard personally, was as a youngster I went
    to the newstand to buy a newspaper. The headline said " Benny Leonard died refereeing 6 bouts at St. Nicholas Arena". I took the paper home and gave it to my dad...He Wept...And he was a tough guy..I have never heard
    anything negative about Benny Leonard in the ring or as a referee...Cheers..