Dempsey doesn't belong in HW top 5's. Perhaps not HW top 10's.

This is where your agenda loses steam as there was not a lot spectacular about Jack Dempsey at the dawn of 1917, at least not to the boxing public, and he had yet to meet Jack Kearns, his future deal making machine. He was hustling through each town trying to get big fights via showing the local promoters his paper clippings from his fights - he was hardly motoring at this point.

If you would take to time to dig up news reads they will tell you of how Flynn was easily dispatched out of the ring in the return.

The reason there is smoke concerning the first fight is because there was varying opinions on the validity of the outcome. And that was not for 'greatness' sake, it was just an unknown with many stories surrounding the event.

 

It would be a stretch to call Dempsey a young spectacular prospect at this point.

He was nobody.

It was an honour for him to share a ring with the great Fireman flyn who got beaten up by two world champions.

We cant prove that the fight was a fix andshouldnt asume that it was.

At the verry least however you should have grave doubts about it.

 

double post

 

make that a triple

 

I certainly wouldn't agree with that, i would put tyson, lewis, louis, ali, holmes, foreman, liston as all much better than evens.

 

I did before I learned the subtlties of Dempseys style.

Dempsey was the best all round ofensive fighter the heavyweight division ever saw.

Mike Tyson was a Jack Dempsey who never completed the aprenticeship.

With the names you mentioned, Dempsey could loose against them but he could also turn them inside out if they made a mistake.

 

in all reality de,psey never faced anyone like a lewis, i have serious doubts that he could do much against lewis, i think lewis's reach, power, strength and boxing ability are pretty much the worst matchup for dempsey.
I do not honestly see how people can rank dempsey so highly when his resume is somewhat poor compared to most top heavyweights after the ali period.

 

I disagree, Sonny liston had a better run. Sonny beat 4 of the top 5 heavyweights of his era pre title cleveland williams, zora folley, eddie machen, nino valdez. dempsey did not beat wills, norfolk, greb, langford pre title. Liston cleaned out both the white and black heavyweights pre title. dempsey only cleaned out the white ones.

Joe Louis also had a better pre title run too, he beat 3 linear HW champs pre title

 

Dempsey gets a place in my top 10.

Yes his opposition does not look that impressive with hindsight and the colour bar robbed us of even more potentail match-ups, but his iconic status in boxing history means he has to be a top 10 fighter in any serious list of all-time Queensberry rules Heavies.

He was not just boxing, but he was THE sporting icon of the 20s, a goldern era of the sport. A man so big, he could make a Million Dollars for one fight. A man, who along with Carpentier had the first truly international Super Fight, as we come to know it in the 70s/80s and early 90s.

Dempsey was a pioneer who helped make our sport, just for that he deserves a top 10 place IMO.

 

Ali
Johnson
Dempsey
Louis
Holmes
Well you asked!