Dempsey Vs Ali

About seven years past his prime. His biceps were nearly as big as Liston's and Vitali's. Bigger than Tyson's, and Frazier's.

 

He was 31...and how would that affect his strength anyway? Strength is pretty much the last thing to go.

This seems like an odd argument to me. Dempsey was powerful but never gave off an impression of a particularly strong fighter. Ali was about 30 pounds heavier than him and utilized his physical strength a lot in the 70s. If he could outmuscle a behemoth like Foreman, he's gonna have no issue with Dempsey.

 

Lets put this in perspective:

Dempsey was muscled around by Luis Firpo who was considered a huge heavyweight in that era. Ali was bigger in nearly every department than Firpo and his skills were so much better than Firpo's they aren't even comparable.

Ali-Dempsey would be a mismatch with Ali easily beating Dempsey.

 

How big was Henry Cooper?

 

Dempsey would whoop Ali on the inside I think Ali's footwork is enough to trouble Dempsey. He could win a decision behind the jab. Post exile Ali I would favor Dempsey but pre exile there is no way in hell Dempsey beats him.

 

B.S. to your statement "Dempsey was muscled around by Luis Firpo"...
The truth was Dempsey from the opening bell foolishly rushed Firpo who threw a right hand that cracked Dempsey on the jaw dazing Dempsey with the added force of a man rushing into a right hand. Dempsey was in a fog, but didn't go down. He survived this disaster and later on was clubbed and pushed out of the ring by a truly powerful Luis Firpo. After Dempsey re-entered the ring he truly manhandled Firpo as no other heavyweight would have in his dazed
situation, and destroyed the much larger Firpo in the second rounds...
Dempsey in a rematch would have been more cautious like he was in the Willard massacre circling big Jess around til he went all out in his attack...It was the much heavier Firpo who as the film shows was
"muscled around", the truth be known...

 

a fighter of jacks style stylistically troubles Ali, however I believe he lacks the physical tools to really expose a prime Ali. Ali is superior in almost every single way, Ali punishes Dempsey, but if he makes the mistake of underestimating the man, he could eat some hefty shots and might need to pick himself up off the canvas. Jack wouldn't pressure Ali the way Frazier did, and ultimately lacks the size or power to impose himself on the far superior boxer in Ali. Dempsey imo really has nothing going for him in this fight. Ali stops him late

 

This is in no way a mismatch. A highly competitive fight. Dempsey was quick. Quicker than Frazier and had two very powerful fists. Smaller fighters who could better match Ali in hand speed did better than bigger fighters like Foreman. Dempseys bobbing and weaving style gives Ali fits. Like Frazier showed in 71 Ali was easy to hit with left hooks. Dempseys hook lands early dropping Ali. It's nip and tuck the first 10 rounds with Dempsey in the lead. Ali comes on late to take split decision win.

 

Aside from a super defensive fighter Tommy Gibbons who was never stopped in 105 fights, Dempsey ko'd everyone he met from 1919-23...He is so sorely underrated on this forum by some posters who think that Dempsey was not big enough to hurt bigger mastodons...Evidently all the large men Dempsey annihilated was somehow "hit' by the referee, cause someone or thing put these guys on their back in LaLa Land... Dempsey was as Nat Fleischer described
him as "amazingly strong " had the lean muscularity, litheness and and vicious
temperament that made him P4P one of the greatest power punchers in history
capable of flattening a Clay/Ali as Henry Cooper came ever so close to doing.
But unlike a Henry cooper Dempsey almost NEVER CUT...And doubters who abide that "BIGGER has to be better", remember that the greatest wrestler America ever produced Frank Gotch weighed about 205-10 pounds...

 

Jack Sharkey former hwt champion a fighter who was over 6 foot and scaled around 205 pounds stated the following concerning his bout with an old Dempsey in 1927:

"I never thought anyone could hit that hard"

He further stated Dempsey hit harder than Joe Louis.

Dempsey could hit a ton. Hard enough to ko any fighter at any weight.

 

And hadn't fought in over three years...

He'd been getting soft, ever since he won the title. He'd been living the good life.

Agreed, I think he was stronger and hit harder than Holmes, certainly not Dempsey however.

He BY NO MEANS outmuscled Foreman. Don't know where you're getting this from. :huh

 

Yes because FOTC Ali was no different than pre exile Ali. atsch

 

If a Joe Frazier one of my favorite heavyweights in the FOTC which I saw at MSG
whip Ali, why wouldn't a Dempsey a better two handed fighter than Frazier, not do better against Ali and beat him ? Common sense dictates that ... Only on this forum is Dempsey held in such low regard....I have said this before but it bears repeating. Clay/Ali was a great heavyweight no doubt. Quick and durable, but if Ali had the low key personality of an Ezzard Charles for instance, hid place as the "greatest" heavyweight wouldn't have been so secure or ballyhooed...
He was never much better than Ken Norton in their fights, was held even by Jimmy Young, lost to a peak Joe Frazier, and never annihilated his opponents
like the low keyed killer, my man Joe Louis did for 13 long, long years.

 

Was he talking about when Dempsey sucker punched him while he was complaining to the refs about Dempsey's low blows? The punches you don't see coming are always the hardest.

 

Ali wins this