"Dempsey in his muscular prime was described as "amazingly strong", and contrary to your bias was one tough son of a ***** in the trenches." Yes that is a new low Burt.
You used the word bias first. You then said the use of the word bias was a new low. You then said you fight fire with fire, despite the fact I only responded to your insult.
THAT is a new low?? How about all the posters you have accused of being "haters"... simply because they don't agree with you? And then you get offended, because someone calls you biased!
LUF, this is the first time on this thread where the word BIAS was USED and YOU used it FIRST...I responded to this adjective you hurled my way...Using your word "bias" takes away every posters personal opinions and it is dead wrong...
You are flat out lying. Look at the post you sent to me first on this thread, I'll quote it for you next.
Luf, it seems I did use the adjective word "bias" first, so I apologize. Twenty lashes will be my punishment. OUCH !
He didn't really have a jab at all, it wasn't in his ****nal even if his fans will pinpoint the single short straight left he throw 1 out of 500 punches. He actually didn't believe in it as a punch because it wasn't damaging. It was to his detriment in several fights ofcourse, see Tunney, Miske 1, Brennan. The jab isn't there to be damaging alone, although it can be. It's there to control an opponent, beat them to the punch and take away their jab. It's there to defend yourself too. And yes he was quick enough to get away without a jab against the men he beat but it's when the opposition get quicker and technically better he has a problem.
The Gibbons fight shows him bullying behind a solid jab does it not? Well for someone like Dempsey you will always need enough power to gauge his respect and youll need accuracy to exploit his defensive issues. The clip of him slipping that combo against Tunney is unreal though and it makes me question his abilities as much as watching him walk into a huge right from Firpo.
Hence the short response to you. You can't dismiss everyone who questions Dempsey footage as being biased or haters. Especially if that person is saying Dempsey would be wise to avoid trading punches with none other than Sonny Liston.
Ironically things seem to have started going wrong for Dempsey when he started using the jab more, later in his career. During his prime, his opponents had no idea what he was going to do, until his hook landed. What you perhaps havent got your head around, is that officiators back then often didnt score jabs. If you look at somebody like Panama al Brown, they look a lot like a modern fighter, except that they often dont lead with the jab.
Luf, I am not demeaning the ability of a Sonny Liston pre-Ali. Not at all. Further more I believe that the heavyweights of the Ali prime era were the best group of heavyweight era. I have always posted this belief. Where I differ from many on ESB who utter rubbish that a prime Dempsey and my man Joe Louis were "too small" for today's dreadnaughts ,it irks me no end...These two great heavyweights thrived on bigger, stronger, slower men as their records attest to. It was the more agile smaller men as a Tommy Gibbons, Gene tunney, Bob Pastor, Billy Conn, Jersey Joe Walcott etc, who gave them the most trouble in the ring...Excess weight can make a heavyweight more powerful but it also takes away speed, flexibility and stamina...Nature in her wisdom has a way of giving and taking.