Dempsey Wills breach of contract trial in 1931 won by Dempsey

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by HOUDINI, Mar 29, 2024.


  1. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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  3. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It’s interesting that the trial was concluded after Dempsey in a fit of anger stood up in court yelling at Wills manager as he testified during the trial. Dempsey stated he would “fight Wills right now” and the offer was accepted. Soon after the presiding judge stated that this would fullfill the contract and he directed the jury to render a verdict in Dempseys favor. Trial was over.

    So I have everything settled regarding Dempsey vs Wills up until this point. Then everything becomes cloudy as I can find no mention of what became of this agreement that caused the trial to end.

    The following year the Chicago Coliseum Club appealed the verdict and the appellate judge issued a verdict remanding the case for retrial.

    It was never retried.

    A few years later Dempsey was quoted as saying the attempts to make the fight with Wills “cost him $100,000”. Was this an out of court settlement after the appellate decision? Only speculation at this point in time.
     
  4. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    He won the suit by agreeing to honor the contract five years after he was no longer champion and had been retired for four years and Wills hadnt won a fight of note in six years. Pretty easy to be brave when you have literally nothing to lose particularly when the promoters would then be on the hook for $500,000 for a fight that no longer held any appeal beyond morbid curiousity. However, I would urge you to look up the 1932 appellate course decision that reversed this judge and ordered Dempsey to pay $100,000 in damages...

    Anyone who believes Dempsey was ready and willing to defend against Wills is either ignorant and trying to hide the truth. Period. You cant research this time period in depth and come away with any other conclusion. Dempsey challenging Wills half a decade after the fact does ZERO to change that.
     
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  5. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    LOL, and there it is. You have everything settled until March of 1931 and yet the story doesnt end there. Convenient.
     
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  6. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Not really. Dempsey made the offer and that offer was accepted. Dempseys offer, and Dempsey specifically stated this in court, was that the contract stipulated he get paid 1 million $ and he expected that payment. The plaintiffs agreed.

    So what happened? Did the Chicago Colesium Club obtain financing for this fight? Doubtful as the Great Depression was becoming more of an issue month to month. So if they did not obtain financing but appealed anyway is that fair to Dempsey?

    Bottom line there was only one trial and it was ending in Dempseys favor.
     
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  7. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Fair to Dempsey? They had a contract which Dempsey NEVER intended on honoring. The entire thing was a sham cooked up by him and Floyd Fitzsimmons. If Dempsey refuses to honor a contract to defend his title against his number one contender and gets sued for it later but in order to try to kill the suit he then challenges Wills to a meaningless fight between two basically retired fighters who no longer are anywhere near championship calibre during the depression for a purse that nobody could afford to pay does that really alleviate Dempsey's liability or put the money back into the pockets of the investors in the original promotion? No.

    You said yourself it was appealed and Dempsey was ordered to pay $100,000 in damages. Dempsey later admitted paying the $100,000. But hey, keep trying to rehab you heros image...
     
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  8. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Actually no. I have private correspondence written by Dempsey during this time. One right at the time Fitzsimmons could not pay him the $125,000 contracted pre fight sum where he angrily writes either Fitzsimmons “comes up with the $ or the fight is off”.

    Another once the Chicago Collesium Club steps in where Dempsey writes “I’ve never been involved with anything so confusing in all my life”.

    So the idea the contracts in 1925 and 1926 were farces I believe is false. Why would Dempsey sign a second contract, once the Collesium club stepped in, if the first was a farce?

    I never wrote the verdict was appealed and Dempsey ordered to pay $100,000. In fact please post from that appellate judges decision where he orders Dempsey to pay $100,000.
     
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  9. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Its not my job to educate a guy with an agenda who doesnt want to hear the truth and wont change his mind anyway. You have the ability to search "dempsey" "appellate" and 1932 and see the judges ruling. Its literally as simple as that. The only reason to come on here and challenge me to produce such proof is because you dont want to hear it. So why would I waste my time. Everything to be said on this subject has been posted by me many many times on this forum and you are welcome to search those posts and Im sure you will find any response to any tripe you attempt to produce to defend a guy who ducked his number one challenger for the entirety of his reign while fighting, in order, a dying man, a man he had already knocked out, a light heavyweight who a decade earlier was losing to the best middleweights he fought conclusively, another light heavyweight who got his title shot by losing and eliminator match for it, a hyped up exotic oaf who was literally built up and promoted by Dempsey's promoter specifically as a foil for Dempsey, and another LHW who got his title shot because Dempsey was convinced he would be an easier fight than Wills...
     
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  10. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Actually complete BS. You are the cherry picker. You never posted anything positive regarding Dempsey in your life. Further you never posted anything negative regarding Greb even though many articles from the time spoke of the “Greb problem”. Winning at heavy but doing nothing spectacular enough to gain sufficient public interest. Was any of that information within your book? I thought not. Thus you retain your “cherry picker” status.

    Here is the truth. The appellate judge remanded the case for retrial. He also rendered an opinion as to what costs incurred by the Chicago Club could and could not be reimbursed if the case were to be retried and they were fortunate to win.

    Dempsey did state the Fitzsimmons “deal cost him $100,000” but if you read the appellate decision itself the judge does not order Dempsey to pay anything. He just categorizes various types of expenses and renders an opinion based upon case law as to which are valid to be reimbursed. As one example costs incurred by the Chicago Club prior to the early 1926 contract signing (not to be confused with the 1925 contract signing) would not be reimbursable.

    Their are a few articles that have the headline that Dempsey is liable to pay $100,000 but omit the important point that he would be liable if the case was retried and he lost.
     
  11. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Why is it up to me to post positive things about a guy whose reputation has been so manicured for decades? Does Dempsey need yet another apologist? And why is that on me? Go read Roger Kahn if you want to read somebody fawning over Dempsey and imagining him as a greek god. Jesus.

    What does Greb have to do with this? If you think I didnt write anything "negative" about Greb then you didnt read my book. Tell me what I left out. Please. Its all there in black and white.

    Again, you will believe what you want. Arguing that somehow an appellate decision against Dempsey for $100,000 is a win for Dempsey is the height of stupidity. Because you are too stupid to read the fact that the $100,000 judgement was only part of the damages and the REST of the damages were what was sent to retrial is not my problem.

    Dempsey crying that the Fitzsimmons contract (which he helped orchestrate) cost him $100,000 is the height of hypocrisy when in reality it allowed him to move forward with his fight with Tunney which made him upwards of $750,000. Boo ****ing hoo.

    Now, Ill get back to transferring and restoring Tunney-Dempsey II from the original film to HD. Awfully weird for a guy who supposedly hates Dempsey....

    https://flic.kr/p/2pGaV9d

    https://flic.kr/p/2pGaV9o

    https://flic.kr/p/2pGbtwW
     
  12. SwarmingSlugger

    SwarmingSlugger Active Member Full Member

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    Well it does sound like youŕe not a Dempsey fan for sure.
     
  13. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    I agree. Laughed out loud when Compton of all people wants to call someone out for having an agenda.

    Pot calling kettle black.
     
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  14. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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  15. apollack

    apollack Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Book will be out sometime this year and will thoroughly address all of these topics, the good, the bad, and the ugly.