Did Ali make to many mistakes to beat tyson

Tyson, and Joe Louis beat the 71-75 Ali. I'd also make a peak Dempsey the favorite over that Ali. Reason being Ali couldn't get on his toes and dance for 15, he made up for it with his courage and experience. Against guys like Foreman he still pulled out tremendous victories due to this, but against guys that were accurate, patient, plain great overall punchers he can't simply "rope a dope."

Dempsey, Tyson, and Louis don't punch themselves out and their accuracy and speed is clearly superior to Foreman, who is probably the least skilled HW champ of all time. Frazier wasn't a big puncher like these 3 either, Ali wouldn't be able to take sustained punishment from any of these fighters.

 

Ali isn't flawed at all. His style was flawed in the sense that it was the OPPOSITE of what textbooks/conventional wisdom tell you to do, but for Ali's reflexes and speed his style was masterful.

Guys like Foreman, Marciano (who I rank highly but wasn't a master technician) are definently more flawed.

Tyson is very technically proficient, but there are probably a few others who are greater in that sense so I agree :good

 

Ali and the top 10 of that era beat Tyson. Mike is just not in the same class at all.

 

If I remember correctly you also picked Byrd to beat Tyson, so I'll try to ignore this one.

 

I agree, Frazier was dangerous the whole way through. And he put a consistent body attack on Ali...

 

Do as you wish but I am right on both counts.

 

It has been a while sense we have had a Ali vs. Tyson thred.
If this was a prime for prime match up I would say it would be The Tyson of the Michael Spinks fight (The high water mark of his career. Don King would take over and it was down hill from there) vs. The Ali of the Cleveland Williams fight (Ali fought better oponets before and sense but this is probbly his best preformance in a boxing ring.
Ali 26-0-0 (21) is 6′ 3″ with a 80“ reach. 24 yeas old and 212¾ lbs.
Tyson 34-0-0 (31) is 5′ 10″ with a 71“ reach. 21 years old (3 days shy of 22) and 212¼ lbs. Ali has a clear advantage when it comes to reach. Tyson has the advantage in pro experance and power.
Both are masters in their own way in the art of physigicol war-fair. Ali would do everything he could to get under Tyson's skin. Come to his training camp and taunt him. come up with a pome on how he was going to beat him. Tyson might not have been the master of the spoken word that was but he could instill fear in his opoents. While the head games might be fun to watch I don't think they will give either boxer an advantage outsid of physicing themselves up.
The fight: Tyson and Ali might be the two best defensive heavyweights of all time so expect to see more missed punches than expected.
Tyson is the better starter Ali is the better finisher.
If the fight goes to the cards I would expect Tyson to take the first 4/5 rounds. Rounds (5) 6 & 7 are close, and 8-12 belong to Ali
Asuming there are no knockdowns whoever wins rounds 5-7 is going to win.
Styles: This is the clasic boxer vs. puncher fight. I tend to go with the boxer if all things are even. I expect Ali to box moving around the ring using his jab and his 9 inch reach advantage on Tyson, and his speed to avoide Tyson's punches. I expect to move forward try to close the gap and punch with "bad intintions". To use head movement to make Ali miss.
If Larry Holmes could give Tyson some trubble than Ali could give him a lot of trubble. If Floyd Patterson could conect with Ali than so could Tyson.
Chances of a knockout or stopage? If this fights ends before the final bell Tyson is more likely to be the winner. If Tyson dose score a knockout or stopage victory expect to come in the first 4 rounds and no latter than round 7. While I expect Tyson to score a knockdown or two I think Ali is strong enough to go the full 12 rounds. Ali's stradgey will be to stay away from Tyson. If Tyson' defense is off Ali may be able to close one of Tyson's eyes if not both and stop Tyson sometime between rounds 8-12. If they are at their best Tyson slips too many of Ali's punches for that to happen. Also Ali's will focus on defense and try to out box Tyson.
The biggest chance for a knockout would come if Ali gets over cofendent and lets his gaurd down.

 

Why is that deluded?

How often has Tyson lost a decision, as opposed to how often he was stopped?

Douglas and Holyfield both weren't particularly big punchers, but both stopped Mikey.

 

Could a young Tyson have even caught up with the `66` version of Ali ? I mean, Ali was lightweight fast back then...

 

Pre prison Tyson knocks out prime ali imo. Tyson would have caught up with him and was to fast for ali to avoid all night long.

 

i stopped reading after this...

 

i feel alot of what you have said is wrong here to be honest, firstly when you said" you could not miss him" thats bollocks for a start, i would expect ali's speed and movement to finish tyson late, tyson might win a couple of early rounds, but not too many

 

I haaaattteeeeee it when people say "so in so was in a weak/tougher era" - How?

How can you possibly say that one "era" was any more tough than another, if the fighters from each respective era did not compete against the other?

 

Just cause' you hate it doesn't make it an inaccurate statement.

By observation. Watch the fights. Make an assessment of the guys you are watching. Compare them and their strengths and weaknesses. Then grow a pair and say what you think. That's how.

 

i hear what your saying but sometimes its obvious, are the likes of wlad ,chagaev,peters etc as good as ali,frazier foreman?