Did Champion Joe Louis Avoid Maxie Rosenbloom ?

Slapsie gets demolished like John Henry probably retires and we hear more about it being the end of the road for Slapsie rather than Louis’s performance.

 

Come to think of it, Louis should be damned for not taking this fight!

 

Wow yeah what a shame, would love to see him in the ring!

 

I agree. Maxie was a heavyweight since 1934 and has the style and defense need to give the slow footed Louis problems. He also had one heck of a chin. Focus on the opponents he fights which were Joe Louis opponents, including Bob Pastor who gave Joe Louis a tough fight and made him look bad the first time. If Louis had fought Rosenbloom it would certainly rate as one of his top ten title defenses. IMO Louis was not interested.

 

There are two different issues with Rosenbloom.

One is that he seems to have been persona non grata with the NBA and NYSAC. He had been stripped of his title and banned in the east because of his open-gloved boxing tactics. So an issue is raised if even if Louis agreed to a Rosenbloom fight, would the NBA or NYSAC have authorized it? This controversy might explain why the NBA never rated him at heavyweight.

Second is how strong a contender was he? He was beaten by Lovell and KO'd by Jimmy Adamick in 1937. He got a decision over a green Nova in 1938, and drew with Pastor. But his draw with Pastor was sandwiched between Pastor's losses to Nathan Mann and Gus Dorazio, both of whom did get shots at Louis. So this in and of itself is not overwhelming. No particular reason to fight him, especially if Louis might be risking getting stripped of his title if the NBA didn't authorize the fight.

"It would certainly rate as one of his top ten defenses"

I don't think so. Not even in the top fifteen. He would have been a famous name scalp, though.

"Bob Pastor who gave Louis a tough fight and made him look bad the first time."

The official scoring for that fight was 8-2, 8-1-1, and 6-3-1, so it was a very decisive decision for Louis. Did Louis look as bad as Frazier did against Bonavena? Or Ali against Jones? Or Liston against Whitehurst? Seems to me you are puffing the negative take up far beyond what it merits.

 

Doing some research on newspapers.com, it appears that the biggest push for a Louis-Rosenbloom fight was in 1936, before Louis won the title. Maxie was campaigning in the papers saying he would “slaughter” Louis, and supposedly Mike Jacobs was floating around a $100,000 purse for it.

I can see Louis’ handlers wanting nothing to do with Maxie at that point in time, Louis wasn’t fully formed … Schmeling proved that …and there was absolutely zero upside for Louis to fight him.

Once he was champion and fully formed, I think he utterly tears Maxie to ribbons and it doesn’t take long. By that point Maxie was more actor than boxer, plus looking at his last three fights where he was 2-0-1 against people Louis beat, I certainly give him his due but the fact remains that Nova was a space cadet, and from the real-time coverage Pastor should’ve gotten the victory instead of it being a draw and Ettore had no business being in the ring (and if I’m not mistaken he never fought again) and almost got in trouble with the boxing commission for his (lack of) effort.

I mean, Jimmy Adamick plastered Maxie for the count in two rounds in late 1937 … from the Detroit coverage, he was so thoroughly KO’d folks were a bit concerned about him … I kind of like Louis’ chances to do the same.

I think people are wishfully assuming that (a.) Maxie at his peak was this tremendous defensive fighter; (b.) Louis had a few problems with tricky defensive fighters; so (c.) it’s a given that Joe would have issues with Maxie.

I don’t think that’s a given.

On another note, the LA Times had Maxie at 36 years old in 1939 for the Ettore fight, but Wiki says he was born in 1906 and the IMDB says 1904. Is there definitive proof of his real age?

 

Pastor simply wanted to survive 10 rounds that night.

 

Rosenbloom was only 32 when he retired, Louis has fought much older fighters.

 

Then there is nothing even to debate.

A contender can decline to fight another contender, for any reason, or none at all.

They are both seeking a shot at the champion, and if they are too timid, then they might not get it.

This was clearly not an issue for Louis, after he destroyed men like Carnera, and
Baer.

 

So he probably shared a nursery with Sonny Liston when they were born, basically.

 

"Rosenbloom was only 32 when he retired"

Was he? It depends. Here are a few birthdays for him given online

International Boxing Hall of Fame--September 6, 1904

Internet Movie Database--September 6, 1904

Notre Cinema--January 11, 1907

The Movie Database--November 1, 1907

Martial Bot.com--November 6, 1906

Jewish Virtual Library--September 6, 1904

NY Times Obituary--on death March 6, 1976, given as 71 years old, consistent with the September 6, 1904 date

AcademicKids.com--September 6, 1903

Boxrec--69 at death, consistent with 1906 birth

Wikipedia--November 1, 1907

boxstat--November 6, 1906

Encyclopedia.com--born 1904

Sports Illustrated--born 1904

All this is summed up on the Jewish Boxing Blog:

"The year of Maxie Rosenbloom's birth is a bit of a mystery, but it likely occurred between 1904 and 1907. His birthday is also up for discussion. Maybe it was March 6. Or perhaps November 1. Or it might have been November 6. It could have been September 6."

I hope this clears things up.

As the child of poor immigrants, it is possible he never had a birth certificate. He might not have known himself what year he was born. Unless someone finds a birth certificate, it will just be one of those things impossible to nail down. It seems to be the same with Archie Moore and Sonny Liston.

 

I understand what you mean, my grandparents are also European immigrants that didn't confidently know their birthdates either. However, even if we use the oldest year that Maxie could've been born in according to your sources, 1904, then he would still only be 35 years old. Louis has still fought older fighters than that, so I highly doubt that was the reason. It seems much more likely that Louis' team avoided Rosenbloom for his style rather than his age.

 

What makes you certain they avoided him at all. One can't fight everybody. Louis fought four world heavyweight champions as a contender. So I wouldn't assume they avoided Rosenbloom unless better evidence is produced.