Did Dempsey or his Manager fear Greb thus avoid him? Was Greb asked to leave Dempsey's camp because he was embarrasing Dempsey? Was Dempsey going all out, or just Greb, when the latter seemingly confounded him? Is it likely Greb a~ 165 lbs. would have beaten prime Dempsey? Was Dempsey rocked by Greb even though Greb had a low KO % & sacraficed power for speed & at any rate could not punch like same weight Fitzsimmons? Do you believe these link sources, or partially so & they need context? [url]www.harrygreb.com/dempsey.greb.html[/url]
When did Dempsey not go all out in sparring, especially when he was getting the worse of it? Sources say Greb got by far the better of the action the two times they sparred.
A few thoughts relative to this thread: 1-Harry Greb is my very favorite fighter EVER. 2- It is pretty certain that Harry Greb outsped and outpunched Jack Dempsey in their two sparring sessions which frustrated the Dempsey camp. 3- that being said I have seen so many sparring sessions at Stillmans Gym where headline fighters had the tar kicked out of them by their sparring mates who were not nearly as talented as the top fighters they embarrassed in the gym. In a real bout they would lose to the headliners big time... 4- For the Dempsey camp those days, fighting the great MW Harry Greb {who Jack Kearns called 'the 7 year itch ] would be TRULY a "No Win situation". If Harry Greb in a championship 12-15 round title bout somehow avoided Dempsey's ko punches and won a decision over the 30 -5 pound heavier Dempsey, well their goes the Dempsey meal ticket and millions of dollars...But if Dempsey did catch up to Harry Greb and flatten the smaller MW Greb, cries of outrage would follow saying to Dempsey "why don't you pick on someone your own size, you bully". Truly for the Dempsey entourage a "No Win Situation", to be avoided at all costs... 5- I recall as a youth reading an article written by a prominent boxing writer whose name escapes me today in which he quoted Harry Greb confiding to him these words " after 5 or more rounds Dempsey would have killed me" Unquote. For what it's worth....At any rate ,were I Dempsey's braintrust those long ago days, I wouldn't have matched my meal ticket Heavyweight champion Dempsey with that "seven year itch" MW Harry Greb either. Truly a No Win Situation, period...
Dempsey did usually take it easy on Jock Malone and Panama Joe Gans, Joe Benjamin too,they were there for speed. But Jack could be brutal to the bigger guys. I'm fully convinced he tried to nail Greb. "I know when Dempsey was in training for Tommy Gibbons, he had an exhibition/sparring session with a 7'2" 280 pound giant named Ben Wray who was 4-0-0 (4) and Dempsey knocked the big man out in one minute, shattering his jaw. It put the giant on the suspension list for six months. " Larry Gains was a Dempsey sparmate for awhile ,he said they would sit on a bench watching Jack beat the sh*t out of someone, like condemned prisoners,and, "the relief on the face of the guy not picked next was something to see".
I dont know. Jack was pretty famous for not being able to pull his punches. He knocked out Midget Wolgast in sparring as well as Paul Gallico, who wasnt even a fighter. There were numerous reports from several of his training camps were a local wanted to get in the ring with him just to say hed been in the ring with Dempsey and Dempsey knocked the guy dead. If hes that hard on guys he outweighed by 60+ pounds and novices should we assume he was taking it easy on a seasoned pro who could handle himself? The newspaper coverage of both training camps in which Greb sparred Dempsey is pretty good.
Loughran got the better of Dempsey in sparring too,the footage of that was very one sided.Loughran boxed beautifully landing many uppercuts on the champ
I've no doubt he would have belted Harry if he could have caught him, same as when he sparred with Loughran. Gallico said Dempsey gave him what he considered to be a few taps but Gallico ended up on the floor just the same, he said Jack rabbit punched him in close ,he put that down to"force of habit". .
As mean and cruel Jack Dempsey was inside the ring, he was as courteous and kind outside the squared circle. He dropped big George Godfrey multiple times in sparring sessions, but helped Godfrey financially near the end of Godfrey's life, helped pay his onetime opponent John Lester Johnson's medical bills when JL Johnson was indigent, and to the day Dempsey died, never disparaged any opponent he fought. Is it any wonder why to the day Jack Dempsey died at the ripe old age of 88, Dempsey was always addressed as "CHAMP" by the general public. ? A "killer" inside the ring, a gentleman outside the ring was the Manassa Mauler... "CHAMP", by millions of boxing fans
Greb actually did better than Dempsey vs. several of the same opponents. IMO, the fight should have been made.
