Did see the decline of a fighter before anyone else

when a guy has the money and personal problems that mike had at the time, it was ineveitable that it would take its toll on him in the ring

its happened to a ton of fighters. One of the rinG OR KO magS had a cover:

"MIKE TYSON: WHEN AND WHO WILL BEAT HIM"

thats my explaination

You could argue that tyson was on the decline before the spinks fight. all due credit iron mike, spinks was very nervous before the fight, which you could argue played a hand in the first round ko

 

Disagree, Tyson was all business. Despite his outside of the ring controversy, He still put his work and showed absolutely nothing that would indicate he was slipping. Conversely he showed that he was getting better and better.

Bruno I was the first time where he didnt show the same finesse that he had prior to. Fortunately he always maintained a stylistic advantage to Bruno and therefore he maintained a 0 on the L column. The signs emerged in his first fight with Bruno. But from Mercedes to Spinks he was all business.

 

Ali after his exile, but I suppose everyone seen that before Frazier beat him. However, he went onto prove it was hardly the end.

Roy Jones when he fought Tarver the first time.

Hagler when he fought Mugabi.

 

:good
I agree 100%. Bruno1 was the 1st tell tale sign of Tyson's possible future demise.

 

Even though he won every round I thought Jeff Fenech looked vulnerable in his warm up fight with journeyman Migual Francia shortly before the Nelson rematch.

He was jolted a couple of times as he powered forward even though Francia was the very definition of feather fisted.Also his punches didn't seem to have any power behind them,which made me feel decidedly uneasy going in against Azumah Nelson.

Fenech's subsequent loss whilst shocking in it's brutality wasn't a total surprise to me.

 

What did you all see in tyson against bruno,who he damn well destroyed in both fights in a pretty brutal fashion???
Not knocking any ones opinion,just never really saw to many of tysons earlier fight live at the time,and have only really seen under half of his first fights before bruno? How much better could he have been before then?
Bruno in the first fight caught him with one good shot,but that was about it,in the 2nd he nearly **** himself,his whole body language and eyes gave him away in that 2nd fight,any one could see he himself had thrown in the towel before he had even got into the damn ring.

 

A weird example would be Julio Cesar Chavez. It was clear in the Mayweather rematch that he was not quite fighter he once was at 130 and 135. Yet it was not until the Tyson upset against Douglas a year later and Chavez's win against Taylor that JC Superstar was generally considered the finest fighter in the world. A title many considered he held for a further three and a half years, and yet the indication was there, he was not fighter he once was IMO.

 

I think John Garfield wants us to give examples......what is it that we saw in these fighters that led us to believe, he's on the decline now.

I'll take the Tarver-Jones KO .......the fight previous, Jones was constantly on the ropes and just plain covering up without even attempting to set up to counter.

If you look at Jones at his prime, even when he went to the ropes, usually his body was positioned to place a counter.
He did'nt do that against Tarver.
In his first fight with Tarver, Jones only offense was to potshot at center ring or give a two or three shot combo and back right back to the ropes to cover up!

Thats the sign of a fighter who's reflexes have slipped, and in Jones case, even though he had some sucess at center ring vs Tarver, I dont think he was comfortable there once he got his own shots off, to stay there and counter of what was to come from Tarver once Jones threw his own shots.......thus Jones went to the ropes.

The quickness and speed was slipping......the fighter himself is the last to admit it......but I think Jones deep down knew his predicament.

 

Totally agree.

 

I cant say Ive be astute in this area ,I did see the decline in Tyson against Bruno ,but I think it was obvious to everybody,the headmovement the combinations the concentrated rythmic execution wasnt there,I didnt think Douglas would beat him,in fact I thought Tyson might really hurt Holyfield,so this obviously isnt my forte!

 

The problems he had come out after the spinks fight. don't you remember or recall the summer 1988. he was never out the news. it was for all to see that he was on the slide

 

He beat Bruno desicively, but he didnt look as precise as he did before. His head movement looked stiffer, reflexes sharp but movement and fluidity and technique seemed off.....At the time it would have been harder to spot but in retrospect he could have been beaten that nite by a fighter with a stylistic advantage.

 

I dont agree that Tyson's headmovement had decreased to a great degree in either of his fights with Douglas or Holyfield.

In each case the headmovement was there as usual early, but once Douglas and Holyfield continuously start hammering Tyson despite the headmovement......
.....from my view, the headmovement from Tyson decreases as the rounds go by for two reasons.....

1 Fatigue clearly sets in as each round passes, so logically there will be less of everything.

2.Tyson must be thinking, why the hell waste so much of my energy with headmovement when I'm getting my head bashed in anyways.