Did Willie Pep lack heart?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Addie, Oct 3, 2010.


  1. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Just so we don't have old timers or avid supporters of Pep going ape ****, I'm simply posing the question and trying to get to bottom of the results in two of his fights with Sandy Saddler. Unfortunately, I haven't seen the first two fights, but I realize he lost the opener by stoppage and then avenged that with a masterful boxing display. I'd be nice to be able to view these fights for myself, but fights 3 and 4 were quite ambiguous to say the least.

    Willie Pep was pretty much handing out a boxing lesson in the third fight, despite suffering a serious knockdown. His combination's were working well, and Saddler was basically being kept off balance by Pep's jab and his constant movement. The fight wasn't being watched in it's entirety but the highlights clearly showed Pep getting the better off the action with his boxing. Then suddenly, in-between rounds, Pep is forced to quit on his stool because of a dislocation. I'm not a fighter, I've never experienced this myself, but I tend to think it's pretty serious and nearly impossible to carry on with such an injury.

    Fight four was much of the same, despite Pep sustaining a knockdown, and looking pretty weak as the fight progressed, I still thought he was getting the best of what clean action was to be seen. This altercation was very dirty, with thumbings of the eye, wrestling, and Pep constantly hooking his feet around Saddler's, seemingly in attempt to trip him to the canvas. It wasn't pleasing on the eye, but some of Pep's offensive work certainly was. Again, Pep could no longer continue late on in the fight and Saddler was awarded the winner.

    Willie Pep was obviously a walking miracle to be fighting at this point in the first place considering the plane crash, but he seemed fairly fragile to me. I can excuse the dislocation, that's obviously quite serious, but even in the fourth fight, the knockdown seemed to be pretty soft, and was a result of just inside pressure as opposed to any solid punch. Moreover, in the fourth fight, Pep seemed to be weakening fairly quickly after some body shots and all of the wrestling going on. Instead of going out on his shield, or even attempting to win the fight, he wasn't allowed to continue.

    Can someone clear this up? Am I missing some important points leading up to these stoppages? Were these the ill effects of the plane crash Pep suffered? The stoppages just seemed a little soft to me, at least the knockdowns did.

    Discuss.
     
  2. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He made it no secret that he just didn't feel like carrying on against Saddler with injuries. He had fought and won the second fight with a horrible cut and did not feel like repeating the effort against the rough and tough Saddler. Basically he had just lost his desire by the fourth Saddler fight.
     
  3. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Was he criticized at the time? I tend to think had he been operating in today's Featherweight division, and would openly admit to "not feeling like it" after a grueling fight, he'd be heavily criticized by fans and sports writers.
     
  4. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think you may be confusing the two fights. Pep got knocked down with a flush left hook from Saddler in the third fight. Saddler knocked down Pep in the fourth fight with a barrage of punches in the corner.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9QB6HVTndw[/ame]

    4:30

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2ixK9uJBp4[/ame]
     
  5. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Yeah, reading it back, I recognized this myself but didn't think anyone would call me out on it. Damn you, GreatA!
     
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :lol: Christ man, know your audience.
     
  7. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Watching that link you posted here GreatA, those short uppercuts inside looked pretty nasty actually.
     
  8. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Why do you very rarely ever address the thread question? :think
     
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    :blood
     
  10. Duodenum

    Duodenum Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This can depend on pain tolerance, as well as which side the
    dislocation is on. Obviously, it would be more difficult
    to perform if the jabbing side had the impairment.

    Here's the episode which probably jumped into the minds
    of several posters when they read what you typed
    about having a dislocation:
    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QY1jzjTjIhY[/ame]
     
  11. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I can never see that vid too many times :thumbsup
     
  12. Pachilles

    Pachilles Boxing Addict Full Member

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    McGrain is a promising, mature poster but he still lacks the boxing knowledge of say myself, bukkake, hhascup, etc..
     
  13. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    :lol: McGrain is a stellar poster and infinitely more knowledgeable than myself, but he doesn't ever seem to the address the thread question, at least not in my threads. Just curious as to why that is, that's all.
     
  14. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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    He's distracted by either the infinite beauty of Win, infinite cuteness of Bjork or infinite badassness of Barrera...etc.
     
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Goodness knows what has left you with this impression...however, you are clearly in need of instruction, and it will be my great pleasure to provide it :D

    There are currently 15 threads on the front page in which I have posted. Of those, i've responded directly to the OP question in at least 9 cases. I can't be bothered to trawl through the "smallest fighter to beat Wlad" thread to see if I gave a direct, serious answer, so it might be ten. I also may have given a direct and serious answer in the history of the black HW title thread. So it could be as high as eleven.

    So that would be 9-11/15...hardly "rarely or never", I should say.