Discuss fighters Jones Jr ducked in his prime

I understand that it wasn't your list, but you've been happy to copy it, and you've gladly implied in most of your posts, that Roy chose easy fights and ducked all of these deserving guys.

I'll admit that Roy missed out on good names and he ducked/dismissed a few fighters, but your posts read as though he handed HBO a weak list of 6 guys and said "Here I want to fight them" That's how your posts read.

There's 13 guys on that list, and 6 of them definitely didn't deserve a shot. Whoever compiled that list was a complete idiot! There were 2 fighters that didn't even fight at 168 while Roy was there, so it wasn't objectve.

I haven't been biased in anyway. Liles and Collins were deserving, but Liles was with King, just like Benn was. Zod's got links of Don wanting options for a Benn fight, and I've also given a link that states in 1995, Fred Levin didn't want Roy doing any business with Don at 168. We've already discussed Eubank not wanting big fights too, so that only leaves a handful of fighters.

So has your opinion changed, now you've seen the stats on each fighter?

Surely you've got to admit, that the list was wrote from a biased perspective, and they weren't all deserving, and Roy didn't avoid all of them?

 

Jones was at 168 from 1994 to 1996. After winning an alphabet strap against Toney, he fought noone from the top 3.

Let's see who he fought shall we?

Antoine Byrd: Ranked no. 10 by the ring. Only decent win was against Nicotra 2 years before. Since then he fought only novices to qualify for a shot at Jones. :deal

Vinny Pazienza: Ranked no. 5 based on wins over Roberto Durans shell. Paz was a juiced up LW and surely we can agree he had no business fighting Roy. An utter joke. :deal

Tony Thornton: Unranked. Lost to Collins and Eubank among others. Was unqualified and had zero credentials for a shot at Roy. :deal

Merqui Sosa: Unranked. Non-title fight. Zero qualifications for a shot at Roy. :deal

Eric Lucas: Unranked. A clear loser against novice Brannon and Tiozzo who was the only world class operator he had been in with. Another joke of a fight. :deal

Bryant Brannon: Unranked. A 'veteran' of 16 fights and no significant wins under his belt. LMAO. :deal


This leaves us to judge his work at SMW and considering he spent 3 years in the division and only has a single notable win what shall the verdict be? :huh

 

Bat, I'm not disputing the fact, that those guys weren't great who he fought after Toney. I know they weren't. I know that half of the guys on the list were probably more deserving. I'm not going to pretend that these guys who Roy faced were great. The point I'm making is, for various reasons, a lot of the better quality opponents from that list, couldn't be made. You won't accept this. You're not allowing for circumstances.

Eubank didn't want to know. Again, Benn and Liles were with King, and Levin didn't want to deal with him. Nunn only fought at 168 twice while Roy was there. Why's Roy getting all the blame?

Just go back to the last page, and read my reply to Zod on post 262. There's a link at the bottom of the page. Just have a quick look if you haven't already seen it.

Roy won the IBF belt from Toney. Tony Thornton and Bryant Brannon were no.1 and no.2 with the IBF at the time.

What's the verdict?

The verdict is, he embarrassed the best guy at 168, couldn't get other fights, so decided to move up to 175. That's the verdict. Has he got a weak resume at 168? Yes and No. Yes because he only had 6 fights, but no because he embarrassed the best guy. Toney was the favourite, and was considered one of the best fighters in the world.

Like I keep saying, you refuse to allow for circumstances.

 

The verdict on Jones resumé at SMW is probably above average and that's solely based on him beating (a drained) Toney.

Let's face it. Sven Ottke did more than Jones in half the time.

I don't know if I refuse to allow for circumstances, but given the fact that Jones had a fat contract with HBO (I believe) and him having a history of wanting more than the lions share of any purse, the onus was on Jones for making bigger fights and he surely could have made them had he wanted to.

 

He only had six fights there, and beat the best guy.

Who out of the 13 fighters on the list could have embarrassed Toney like that?

Sven Ottke? Who did Sven dominate who was as good as James Toney? The only thing Sven has over Roy is Longevity.

You're also forgetting two important things. The only reason Sven was the IBF Champion in the first place, is because Roy vacated the belt when he moved up. Sven also had the opportunity to fight for the WBA belt. Roy never had that same opportunity of fighting for a second belt, because he and Levin didn't want to tie in to King. Life is all about circumstances and opportunities.

Guys like Ottke and Calzaghe wouldn't have achieved anything at 168, if Roy had've stayed there for the majority of his career. Those guys are lucky that he left the division.

Of course he wanted the lions share of the purse, he was the best fighter in the World.

We've discussed the DM fight to death, but you can accept that Roy made an effort to make that fight in America.

He also tried to make the Hopkins rematch.

I can also provide links, of the efforts that Murad Muhammad made to try and make fights with Holy, Lewis and Tyson. Yes he missed a few fighters, but he wasn't half as reluctant as people like to make out.

 

Watch BatTheLan disappear when froch arseholes kessler in the rematch rofl:roflatsch:deal

 

It was apart from (the drained) Toney.

So you are holding it against Ottke that the belt was vacated by Roy? At the same time you are holding it against DM that he was unfairly stripped of his belts so that Roy could pick them up. LMAO. Dude. You have some doublestandards. :nut

So it is legit to avoid some fighters by stating that they want nothing to do with their manager?

Her we go again. Roy is the king of fantasy fights. A good thing because his real resumé at SMW leaves a lot to be desired. Keep dreaming.

He priced himself out plenty of times as I recall it. (I won't look for evidence as I suspect you agree there).

I can accept that Jones wanted DM on one of his undercards to potentially set up a clash.

Can you accept that Kohl tried to get Jones to Germany for a DM fight and not some undercard slot?

Dude. Jones said he wanted Lewis, but that was bull****. He settled for Ruiz because he was the easiest way towards a (paper)strap.

 

Why is it alwasy Jones that gets the blame for not fighting these guys. Does it not enter people minds that maybe there were top fighters who wanted nothing to do with RJJ?

We know Eubank didnt want to fight him. He admitted it.

Benn admitted in an interview that it was politics that meant that he didnt get the Jones fight and also said he "had no problem being no.2 to Roy Jones"

The guy only fought..what? 9 fights at SMW?

 

First - you say that as if Herol Graham wasn't a highly skilled, world class boxer. McCallum called him the best boxer he ever faced, he said: He [Graham] was a pure boxer, a southpaw and very elusive. It wasn’t easy to hit him. He was very smart, very skilled.

Second - did Graham ever chase Eubank? Was he ever calling for a fight with Eubank? Was he ever in line in the WBO for a fight with Eubank? If yes to any of those and Eubank refused a fight then Eubank ducked, if no and fight didn't happen because Graham didn't go after it or didn't get in a position to be given it then Eubank didn't duck.

You cant duck someone if they're not trying to fight you. Which is the same reason Jones didn't duck Eubank - Eubank wasn't trying to get a fight with Jones.

 

Bat obviously doesn't like Roy... He can't even include Toney without putting (drained) in front of it...

He is a waste of time.

 

He always gets the blame.

Why does DM not get the blame? Or King for being greedy? Or Hopkins for demanding 50/50 and not taking the 40% that would have made him alot of money, even if he'd have given up a percentage of it?

 

Have you seen the guys that were supposed to be deserving of a shot?

Two of them didn't even fight at 168 while Roy was there, and four other fighters only had the one fight there.

Out of the 13 fighters he's listed, six of them weren't deserving, and other fights couldn't get made for various reasons.

 

How many of the challengers Roy fought at SMW was deserving?

 

Lol. And you just keep talking out of your ass. You are not the type to have proof disturbing a good opinion.