Distinguished columnist Steve Kim exposes Ring Mag., lineal title

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by BigReg, Apr 8, 2008.


  1. BigReg

    BigReg Broad Street Bully Full Member

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    It's not semantics, you change the whole context of what I posted

    Says who? I still haven't even figured out how he got the title in the first place.

    You said that the linel champ was clearly better than the ABC champ, or something of that nature, I made a counter argument of why this wasn't neccesarily the case. If Mayweather gave up his belt rather than face Cotto you could make a damn good argument that Cotto was a better champ than the lineal champ.

    He also gave up his titles rather than fight top ranked fighters.

    There are 10 ring champs. Hopkins won't fight any LHW's, Calzaghe just won the ring title. Now he' fighting a LHW and wants to fight a MW next. Pavlik is fighting a guy who's not even top 10 by the ring. Floyd isn't fighting WW's. Hatton won't fight the no.1 contender but at least is fighting top 10 ring JWW's. Casa didn't fight for a year. Pac just got his title, but is now leaving the division.

    Once again, if they the orgs had no ability to pick who their champ fought, they would be just like the ring. There would be very little reason for even having rankings. I don't see how the opponents become limited.

    Give me some examples of fighters being stripped. If I'm familiar with the situation, I 'll probably be able to give you a justifiable reason for the stripping without using the rules.


    They were scared off by potential litigation. WBC knows what it's like to be sued. They knew that making Peter wait was probably against their own rules.
     
  2. BigReg

    BigReg Broad Street Bully Full Member

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    That's not true. Cotto has nothing that Floyd wants. He already has a title. Therefore, he has less incentive to fight for Cotto's title. Here's another issue; what if Floyd is Cotto's mando, but Cintron is Floyd's mando, and Quintana is Cintron's mando? You can see how this could cause problems. You and I know damn well Floyd would never accept a 50/50 split against Cotto.
     
  3. BigReg

    BigReg Broad Street Bully Full Member

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    The fact that the Ring does not have mandos, makes their rankings pretty much null and void. Being ranked no.1 by the ring only helps you if the champ retires or leaves the division. Even then, you have to hope the no.2 or no.3 guy wants to fight you. The ring can have the best rankings ever. However, if they rarely rely on these rankings, then they are useless.
     
  4. Relentless

    Relentless VIP Member banned

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    is bigfag still crying?
     
  5. BigReg

    BigReg Broad Street Bully Full Member

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    A simple response from a simple poster.
     
  6. kg0208

    kg0208 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    1) I changed no context. What you posted was speculation.

    2) Says their own rules. He hadn't signed to fight Freitas before he was stripped. We know this for a fact. And we know he was stripped before the deadline to fight Diaz because Diaz fought Morales before the deadline was even up. Simple.

    3) He was clearly better than the other champs in the majorities eyes. He gave up some titles to fight OTHER champs. Not just to not fight JMM, who again, was a nobody. Interesting point you bring up....Why has Mayweather not been stripped by the WBC?

    4) Hopkins is a good example. Calzaghe has been Ring champion since 06, then beat their #1 contender. Bad example since Kessler is still #1 contender for obvious reasons. Pavlik is NOW fighting someone who isn't Top 10, after rematching the former Ring champion. Bad example. Mayweather, yes, he is holding up the division. And Hatton is only choosing not to fight ONE fighter. Up in the air on that case. You named 2 good examples IMO out of 10 champions.

    5) Who said anything was wrong with being like Ring. Not me. If they rated better fighters all the time, this wouldn't be an issue. You ever compare the rankings of each org? They have fighters ranked #1 in one org that isn't rated top 10 in another.

    6) So they would have broken their rules if they could have. This makes it better HOW?
     
  7. kg0208

    kg0208 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    What Mayweather won't accept and what is right are not the same thing.

    Cotto has nothing Mayweather wants? He doesn't want to prove he is the best in the ring? Or unify? Neither the ABC orgs OR the Ring are doing anything about this. So its not relevant.

    And in your highly unlikely scenario? They use that "special circumstances" clause you seem to have no problem with to let the 4 fight each other and then force the winners to face off.
     
  8. Lance_Uppercut

    Lance_Uppercut ESKIMO Full Member

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    Mayweather saying Cotto isn't big enough for him is the same as pricing one's self out IMHO.
     
  9. dangerousity

    dangerousity Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ok again were going back to them having a problem. Nobody is disputing that. But if we can agree that despite all their problems, they still have the best rankings, then we can agree that they have the best list of champions. Therefore Ring champions is higher regarded than ABC champions. Simple logic youre trying so hard to complicate...
     
  10. Ramshall1

    Ramshall1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Fraud is gonna duck Cotto no matter what, Ring mag mando or not.

    mandatories are only a good idea if you have good rankings to begin with - and ABC do not. The better the mandatory is the more likely the fighter will throw the belt in the trash ala Riddick Bowe to avoid Lennox.

    plus if you have #1 ranked as a mando and the champ fights #2 ranked for three times more money then its bad to strip the champ IMO. Perhaps they should say - Champ must fight a top 3/5 ranked fighter at least once a year to keep linear belt . . . but then injuries come into play. So thats why ring mag makes it harder to strip their linear champ - look at the horrible reasons ABC belts use to strip champs.

    Again, you can find fault with it cause it aint perfect or you can recognize that its MUCH better than ABC crap. The more fans ignore ABC and defer to ring mag the better off the sport will be.
     
  11. BigReg

    BigReg Broad Street Bully Full Member

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    That's why it would be counterproductive. Why make someone a mando who has no interest in fighting the champ?

    It's extremely relevant to the argument. Ranking another org's champ is counter productive. They only way it would work is if all the org's agreed to work together and forced their champs to honor their mando status.

    What the hell are you talking about?
     
  12. Bubba

    Bubba Boxing’s not as popular as it used to be, right? Full Member

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    The Ring magazine lost its credentials when DLH bought it.
     
  13. Lance_Uppercut

    Lance_Uppercut ESKIMO Full Member

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    Ring really needs to adress the fact that some Ring champs will NOT face anyone top ranked and rather chase money fights ala' Hopkins and Mayweather right now.

    They should add a stipulation that they will strip their Champ unless he defended against a top 5 Ring Ranked fighter w/i a year (or at least have signed contracts by the two parties).
     
  14. KO Boxing

    KO Boxing Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree
     
  15. Ramshall1

    Ramshall1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hops is facing clearly the best SMW after beating the best LHW. I aint no Hops fan but stripping him for that would be dumb.