Do People's Expectations & False Perceptions Of Reality, Affect Their Judgement While Scoring?

vast · Jun 17, 2022

Olu G. Rotimi said: ↑

No I don’t I score on subjectivity rather I score on objectivity. You love certain fighters and hate others hence your scorecards reflect your bias.
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LMAO you're the most subjective twat on the site.

Wizbit1013 · Jun 18, 2022

shadow111 said: ↑

Well said. You hit on the main issues. The remedy is going through the rounds in question, posting clips where necessary, from multiple angles including fan cams if possible, and support your view of a round through relevant video evidence.
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Which kills everything natural about the sport

Wizbit1013 · Jun 18, 2022

shadow111 said: ↑

I'm annoying? I'm not trying to be annoying at all. I'm trying to HELP. And I don't claim to be perfect. If you disagree with me on anything I welcome disagreement and am very willing to own up to anything that I'm wrong about. I am very grateful to have a platform to post clips to show important parts of rounds that are relevant to scoring. I go out of my way to support my views and I try to be thorough so people can't just say I'm pushing narratives. If you think I'm pushing narratives, then call me out on it. This isn't a joke CST, there are a lot of narratives that I'm exposing and again whether you agree or disagree, I'm only trying to help and make people aware of the lies and disinfo.
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You are very annoying

Wizbit1013 · Jun 18, 2022

CST80 said: ↑

Yes.... very. I know you're not, but you lack self awareness and are oblivious to it. No, you're trying to twist everything to the breaking point and fit square pegs in round holes, to push your agenda. You're wrong constantly, and never own up to anything. I'm glad you have it as well, even though I think you're bat**** insane and wrong 90% of the time, but I love free speech. You've fail miserably if that's your two intentions. I would debate you, but the shadow realm vortex can be a maddening one to enter, I avoid arguing with mental patients for the same reason. Sadly, I know this isn't a joke for you. Tin foil hat types do the same thing all of the time as well. You know, like those people who think the earth is flat.

For the record, I do bizarrely like you, even though I think you're bat**** insane, and there is something somewhat admirable about seeing someone swim upstream 24/7 as hard as you do. So that in and of itself, is oddly enough laudable, because I do think you're being genuine. Which might be even more terrifying.
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See Shadow, i have told you that you have 0 self awareness

Its not just me that sees it

shadow111 · Jun 18, 2022

Wizbit1013 said: ↑

See Shadow, i have told you that you have 0 self awareness

Its not just me that sees it
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You're annoying.

Wizbit1013 · Jun 18, 2022

shadow111 said: ↑

You're annoying.
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Thanks

ShovelHook · Jun 18, 2022

shadow111 said: ↑

Is it possible that you have a similar emotional investment as it pertains to Canelo that's causing you to not rate his work and you perhaps are falling into the trap of auto-scoring rounds against him? I really try hard not to fall into the confirmation bias loop. We're all human though and of course it's only human nature to play favorites but you can't really let who you like or dislike affect your ability to score.

I think it's important to stress though, even if we disagree on rounds, that we really make an effort to understand which rouns could go either way and make that clear when giving your score. Like "I had it 12-0 Bivol but rounds 1-4 & 9 could surely go to Canelo". That's better than just saying it was 12-0 without making it clear that you recognizing how close and hard to score 5 of the rounds were. Even if someone scored Bivol Canelo 12-0, or something, if said person made it clear that a good amount of those rounds could have gone the other away and if you respect someoone who had it closer, then at least we're making progress and making it clear that a good amount of rounds could go either way and that you recognize closer scores as reasonable. I just find it humorous that some people act like scoring Canelo Bivol as all 3 judges did 7-5 is some crazy thing, but yet the same people pretend that rounds like Round 1 could only be scored for Bivol which is actually mad. We need to build bridges between our scoring of matches, rather than act like your score is the only way to score and people who see matches differently are automatically unreasonable. That's not a mature attitude and far too often that sort of thing seems to be the case.
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You try not to fall into the confirmation bias trap? Of all people, you're among the last who should claim impartiality.

ShovelHook · Jun 18, 2022

Fogger said: ↑

I am at work so I have not had time to fully read and digest @CST80's boxing version of War and Peace, I will say the biggest factor affecting the scoring of a bout is the announcer's and/or the telecast's point of view. With casuals it is the overriding factor in how they score a fight. With hardcore fans I believe it affects the scoring of truly close rounds quite regularly.
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I'll admit that in close rounds I may be paying slightly more attention to my favoured fighter (when I'm properly invested in their career, which is usually when they're Irish). Thankfully I'm usually not too pushed towards one fighter or another, I'm not the kind of guy to fanboy someone unless they have a local tie to me, even then I'll try to call it as honestly as I can.

Serge · Jun 18, 2022

I can confirm that confirmation bias is a thing. Can someone simultaneously be subjective and objective? Would I displaying bias if I said yes they can or no they couldn't? Or what about if I cited someone who agrees with whichever answer I wanted them to, would that be confirmation bias of my bias?

box33 · Jun 18, 2022

shadow111 said: ↑

I sort of take the same approach with you in that I don't challenge you on your scorecards when I see a score that I don't agree with because I know it could start a fight and that can easily be avoided. I would say to you the same thing I said to Markus and Q that rather than look for areas of disagreement and conflict, look for areas of agreement. Start there, find areas we agree on then, which is the path of least resistance but not necessarily the most fruitful one. When you suggest that I'm wrong about everything or 90% of stuff you're not exactly making it easy to join forces. If you were more real about it, and said like well you're wrong on a lot but you're also right about a lot, then we'd be getting somewhere. Like I always say I can lead a horse to water but I can't make it drink.

I do try to keep it entertaining but in the end it's all about keeping it real and trying to improve the situation. I mean, how could anybody ignore the clips of Floyd fouling Canelo in Round 6? Is that part of the 10%? I'm sorry but bad fouling factors into my scoring. I'm not one of these people who only score fouls if the ref sees it and takes away a point. That's giving the ref too much power over my card and would make my score reliant on the ref. That whole idea never made any sense to me since people are so frustrated by judges and want to correct them and often score against them, but then when it comes to the ref some people say you have to abide by the ref's decision in your scoring.

Concepts like this are so outdated CST and limit our ability to score rounds accurately. Even if you thought Floyd won the round, how can you not respect someone who points out clear blatant fouls and refuses to score a round to a guy fouling that much? I don't reward fouls like that, and it wasn't just one borderline foul, they were repeated bad fouls. So if you want to think I'm wrong about everything or 90% or whatever go ahead, but that to me sounds like you're not even trying to look for areas of agreement. If you want to avoid calling me out to avoid conflict, that's good, I pretty much do the same thing with you, but there are areas that we agree on, like with Pac Floyd for example. We're not going to agree on everything, and I think it's safe to say that for whatever reason Canelo seems to be a polarizing figure for a lot of fans so that factors into this.

It could be as simple as you just interpret Canelo's boxing differently, and don't credit it like I do, doesn't mean your wrong but oddly I would like to better understand the reasoning behind it. But if that's going to lead to conflict and fighting, then maybe it's better to leave that alone and focus more on areas of agreement which is pretty much what I've been doing. I have plenty of other posters in here willing to put it on the line and challenge me. I'm really looking to join forces with anyone who respect other peoples scoring. If it has to be the way of swimming upstream as you say, so be it, but if there's a way to agree and disagree and join forces more, I'm all for making that happen.
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There are area's i can agree with you here along with all the other posters, either way good post from most, enjoyed going through all this, good analysis & topic point from the OP.

Boom_Boom · Jun 18, 2022

Yes, which is why I find casual boxing fans scorecards more reasonable and legitimate than hardcore boxing fans. Hardcore boxing fans are too emotionally involved and become blinded with their scoring in favor of their favorite fighter and being that they are Hardcore fans they know all the loopholes to justify a controversial win for their fighter. While casual boxing fans are simple and not invested much in either fighter and can make a quick non-bias decision.

Floyd #1 · Jun 18, 2022

Or when a big underdog does better than expected and wins like 4 rounds and then it's a robbery.

Robney · Jun 19, 2022

Floyd #1 said: ↑

Or when a big underdog does better than expected and wins like 4 rounds and then it's a robbery.
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Then upto an 8 rounder it most definitely is, if the favorite still gets the nod.
4 rounder = shutout
6 rounder = 58-56
8 rounder = draw

DoubleJab666 · Jun 19, 2022

CST80 said: ↑

You literally can't resist making everything about Canelo can you?
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I'll put some positive spin on this: in a roundabout way he also said 'yeah, you're right. Guilty.'

How can anyone score objectively when they're so utterly invested in a fighter that their name is constantly at the forefront of their mind?

Fan boys score differently. Rounds don't start a level playing field, but have to be won from their fighter not by them...

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Do People's Expectations & False Perceptions Of Reality, Affect Their Judgement While Scoring?

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Do People's Expectations & False Perceptions Of Reality, Affect Their Judgement While Scoring?

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