Do you fail to understand...

A great fighter does not always a great trainer make.

 

That's enough of that talk. You're ruining the thread.

 

So now Sam Peter was shot when he fought Toneyatsch - Please give it a rest.

And Arreola:rofl Peter is actually a lot better than Arreola, but of course that is not really saying much.

Adamek? Toney would school Adamek at Lightheavy or Cruiser. The fat, past prime Toney that beat Peter at heavyweight could still out hustle him.

Both Klits (easily) and Povetkin (just about) beat Toney, but then so they should. By rights Toney should have had no business what so ever in the heavyweight division, challenging a young top contender like Peter, but he did becuase of his far, far superior skills.

Oh, and just to **** off PugilisticPower - prime, in shape, motivated Toney at 168 or 175 pulverizes Calzaghe with surprising ease:good

 

Sir, a personal attack on a friend of mine who is a knowledgeable and well respected boxing journalist is beneath you.

What a list like that actually says it that is a revisionist piece of agenda driven drivel.

Good day to you.

 

Your argument is that James Toney carefully selected opponents that couldn't hurt him. James Toney fought Peter in 2007.

Wlad fought Peter in 2005 and 2010!

Toney also ludicrously fought an MMA guy and nearly suffocated to death. Toney will fight anyone for a payday.

Toney would fight crocodiles in swamps for a payday.

 

toney pulverizes calzaghe? yeah, sure he does. is this the same toney who was getting dominated by a faded fighter, lost to complete bums, got absolutely dominated by a young roy jones, and is one of the most overrated fighters on this site? that james toney? calzaghe makes him look stupid and lazy with a wide UD. he does not beat joe at all.

just out of interest, who did toney EVER pulverize?

 

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-k1TllSSE4[/ame]


Toney ended up an underachiever but he was a killer at one time.

 

BTW, James Toney overrated? No.

People underrate Toney based on what they've seen of him at HW. Very good wins over guys like Jirov, Michael Nunn, Reggie Johnson, Holyfield....

Toney was a fine fighter once upon a time.

 

//

 

I hear ya, especially about those mythical match-ups. They can get tiresome. Unfortunately us classic posters are definitely missing out on some of your stories.

 

Pretty much. Just look at the old school guys that first trained Hopkins & Toney. Why do you think Freddie Roach is the best trainer today? It's because he was taught by Eddie Futch, whom learned his knowledge from Holman Williams. There's a lifeline of knowledge to proper fundamentals and techniques there.

Hopefully Hopkins and Toney continue on with boxing once they retire to pass down their wisdom. That would certainly be a positive.

This is a great point as well. But if there wasn't a blatant departure from the fundamentals and techniques than these "Modern is always better" advocates would have a good point. The only thing the older "nostalgic" posters would be able to grasp on to is the idea that older fighters are "tougher" because of their circumstances, upbringing, and the era they grew up in.

 

A top 10 HW that was banned for fighting in NY state because he avoided his #1 black contendor. Uh huh, revisionist.

 

Toney was something else back in the 90's. He was still good in to the 2000's but he was at his best in the 90's.
I also think the 90's middleweights and super middleweights. Jones, Toney, Nunn, Hopkins, Nunn, Eubanks, and Ben were the best group in head to head terms, and have the best shot at beating Robinson at middleweight. Even though there have been other more acomplished middleweights.

 

Since you seem to be having some trouble with the word:
re·vision·ist
1. Advocacy of the revision of an accepted, usually long-standing view, theory, or doctrine, especially a revision of historical events.

Jack Dempsey’s destruction of Jess Willard on July 4, 1919 remains one of the most violent outbursts of sheer aggression and power ever witnessed in a boxing ring. It ranks along with Joe Louis one-round annihilation of Max Schmeling and Mike Tyson’s 91-second demolition of Michael Spinks as the greatest massacre in the history of heavyweight boxing.

In 1950, the Associated Press conducted a poll of sportswriters to name the greatest fighter of all-time, pound-for-pound, and Dempsey was the runaway winner, collecting 251 votes. [Joe Louis finished a distant second with 109 votes; Henry Armstrong was third with 13.] The sportswriters of the first half of the century named Dempsey as the greatest fighter they had ever seen.

As late as Dec 1962 Ring Magazine, a panel of 40 boxing writers tabbed Dempsey as the greatest heavyweight of all time.

So it is obvious you don't know Jack. LOL

B. R. Bearden said Jack Dempsey is often criticized for not fighting Harry Wills, even though there is much evidence to prove Dempsey was more than willing to take the challenge. He wrote an article for the newspapers asking for some promoter to come forward and make the fight a reality. The top promoters of the time, especially Tex Rickard, refused. The promoter who did come forward tried to cheat Dempsey out of his signing fee with a check drawn on an empty bank account. Wills had already signed and received his signing fee of $50,000, but when Dempsey tried to cash his check, in the presence of the promoter, it bounced a mile high. He refused to sign until his money was also in hand. No professional fights under those conditions.

And it likely saved Harry a terrible beating.
From Cox's Cornor (to whom you still owe an apology BTW for your insult) Sam Langford, when asked how Harry Wills (whom he fought 18 times in his career) would do against Jack Dempsey, said in the June 5, 1922, Atlanta Constitution "Well if he ever fights Dempsey my money will be on the present champion. Dempsey is the greatest fighter I have ever seen. He hits twice as hard as Jim Jeffries and is as fast in the ring as James J. Corbett."

And you do something even Harry himself didn't do - blame Jack!
Associated Press. December 22, 1958 "Wills fought more than 100 times in a 21 year career that started in 1911 in his home town, New Orleans but he never did get to fight Dempsey for the title. Once contracts were signed but Dempsey's lawyers forfeited his guarantee and Wills collected the $50,000.

Wills said later the Dempsey fight never came off because of the racial issue at the time.

"It wasn't Jack's fault," he commented."

The "he" in that line being Harry Wills himself!

 

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