Do you see Haye knocking Wlad down or making him panic?

What the hell does it matter how many times Wlad has been knocked down? Would it have been better for him to stay down off of the first knockdown of Sanders rather than getting up so he can be knocked down a total of 4 times? Then we have 2 out of 3 knockdowns against Peter being bogus.... there is 7 of them right there. Off balance against TOS 8... exhausted and slipping all over the place against Puritty that's 9.... slip against Pannell which he wasn't even close to being hurt... 10... What's the other one? His standing 8 count against Brewster in which he took MONSTER shots while being completely exhausted and stayed on his feet? That's panic or a bad chin? Those same left hooks absolutely brutalized other opponents, and Wlad took them without going down. He only collapsed AFTER the bell rang and he was pushed by Brewster and tripped over the ref (clearly he was exhausted and finished anyways).... but the point is that none of that showed panic or a weak chin. You talk out of your ass trying to make things seem worse than they were. Peter did NOT give Wlad all he could handle. Wlad dominated every round outside of the 5th and 10th. Sorry... no matter how many times you try to use the scorecards in your favor... the fact that Wlad had 3 knockdowns scored against him and STILL won by that margin on all scorecards just shows how dominant he was in that fight.

Wlad's clinching was a sign of panic? So... Ali's was too? Explain the "panic" in with your logic on that. Tactical clinching has ALWAYS been used in boxing, and Sam Peter was initiating it just as much. He was falling into Wlad allowing it to happen. Let alone the fact that Peter landed his hardest, most flush punch of the fight towards the end of the 3rd round... and it didn't even faze Wlad. Your logic is simply horrible. Peter actually landed a few flush power punches in that fight that didn't do anything to Wlad. In reality... I only saw him hurt by rabbit punches. Even the knockdown in the 10th was started by Wlad losing his equilibrium due to a punch behind the head and Lampley even pointed it out as it happened.

You don't do any research. Let's be honest here. You just talk ****... and usually have no idea what you are talking about.

 

Well thats certainly a possibility, but I doubt that Haye will do that. He didnt against Valuev who hits a lot worse than Wlad.

 

I know, thats not what Im debating on. Im saying how can you blame Wlad for having a weak chin? Thas like blaming Chambers for being too short. You cant do that. You can blame a fighter for his skill or style but for his physical attributes.

 

He will definitely make him panic with fast attacks here and there but knock him out?, no way and I'll be seriously shocked if he does. It's safe to say that Haye is indeed the fastest opponent with that kind of power Wladimir will ever face, can't wait to see this happen.

 

Haye has bad stamina and footwork. Wlad's jab will mess him up pretty good.

 

Hey, my pleasure friend. I love to talk boxing especially with a guy who refuses to use profanity in his posts and actually had the balls to participate in the sweet science. I figure a 6 round or so K.O. for Wlad myself. That knockout in the Chambers fight which Steward commanded him to do was scary. That is George Foreman one-punch power and Eddie takes a hell of a punch. Haye has to charge Wlad early and just let loose his entire arsenal. If Wlad can handle that early assault as I expect he can it is over for David Haye. If not, can Wlad get back up from a knockdown and unlike the Sander's fight backpeddle, employ his jab and force David to charge him looking for the counterpunch? In other words has Wlad grown as a prizefighter since the Sander's days under the expert guidance of Manny Steward? I think he has but we will all know the answer when David and Wlad square off. Like you I can hardly wait.

 

You really have it all wrong... all the time. Pressure always brings out the best in Wlad. In reality... Wlad usually looks at his worst when guys just sit back and play defense all night long... which is why guys are trying to do that over and over again... in hopes that Wlad makes a mistake or runs out of gas. When guys come forward trying to knock Wlad out from the start... they get destroyed. Corrie Sanders didn't even open up on Wlad until he caught Wlad making a huge mistake by backing up with his hands down and stunned him. Only then did he jump on Wlad. Before then, he was being stalked around the ring as he constantly backed away from Wlad.

Go watch Wlad vs Derrick Jefferson to see how "scared and uneasy" Wlad gets when a big puncher is trying to take his head off and come right at him. Brewster himself said in the first fight that he realized right off the bat that there was no way he was going to be able to get to Wlad early by blitzing him. Which is why he gave up on that tactic right away. Luckily for Brewster in that fight... something was clearly wrong with Wlad and he collapsed within himself and gave the fight away. However... credit to Brewster for taking the sort of beating that not too many people could ever stand up to in order to still be around to see Wlad fall apart.

 

May I throw in the towel for Punisher??? He's out on his feet, and someone needs to intervene to prevent lasting damage.

:good

 

Panic - for sure. No question about that. A field mouse can make Wladimir panic. Haye could make him frantically **** his pants with his quick moves. Not sure if Haye can penetrate all the way though.

 

Once again you are way off base. If you have ever noticed. Many of the people considered to have the "best chins" were not that tall. There is a simple reason for this. There is no where to hide. Usually when you get hit with a big punch it comes up directly under the chin as well. However... then you look at a guy like David Tua. Small, stocky frame. He can easily go into a shell and it isn't very easy to dig punches up under it. Also, with that low center of gravity it is much easier to mask being hurt and turtle up to absorb punishment. When guys like Wlad and Lewis ect... are hurt. It is obvious to everyone because of their huge size and body mechanics. Being tall and weighing 245 has nothing to do with taking a punch. However, Wlad has clearly taken plenty of good punches extremely well. A weak chin was never Wlad's problem. Against Sanders and shortly there after as he had a rough stretch on and off for a couple years... he simply had no idea what to do when he was hurt, or in tough situations. He had never experienced them before. He was also caught between styles as he got rid of Fritz... tried out Freddie Roach, then went onto Steward, ect... and you could tell that he was caught between styles in some of those fights making him look awkward at times. However, under Steward he has CLEARLY overcome that and become and MUCH MUCH more complete fighter. He can go 12 rounds and look like he can go another 12 right after, ect... Wlad simply needed a trainer that could mold his amazing talent... and Steward did that.

 

I was speaking more of a general rule of thumb. As I pointed out in Wlad's case though. It was never a weak chin. It was the fact that he was always so dominant, and able to stay away from any sort of real danger that it was a shock when it actually did happen. He had no idea what to do because he had never experienced it before. As I said though... he has gotten over that, and it's obvious. The Peter fight was his crossroads fight were he proved to himself and everyone else that he was able to overcome adversity. All Wlad needed was a great trainer... and the fact that Manny put Wlad through so many sparring rounds that Wlad had to become accustomed to getting hit more... fighting tired, ect... That was the huge turn around in Wlad. He also improved Wlad's technique. Wlad used to get himself into trouble by putting too much behind every punch and severely overextending himself with is follow through. Wlad has learned to sit down on his punches better... still bringing that great power, but not launching his entire body out of position.

Vitali isn't exactly like Wlad. Vitali was used to getting tagged his entire career... so it wasn't something that he had trouble dealing with when it happened. I wouldn't say that means that his chin has to be better. He was just more comfortable getting hit, as it was something that he always experienced. However, as we saw against Sanders... he was rocked just as well when he got hit by a Sanders left as Sanders was on the ropes much like the one that stunned Wlad in their first fight. Vitali simply already knew how to move, survive, and regain his composure. Something that Wlad had to learn within the last 6 years. Wlad didn't actually hit the canvas against Sanders either, until Sanders landed several hard punches as a follow up to that first huge left. Wlad actually looked less hurt than Vitali from the initial first punch... it was how they were able to react after the punch that was the difference between the two. Sanders said that much himself... he simply couldn't get to Vitali again... where Wlad was completely out of his element at the time and began to trade with him in sloppy fashion while hurt. Of course we know that if Wlad was to be stunned now. He could clinch... jab... and move until he regained his composure. It's just experience. Vitali was experienced in dealing with getting stunned... and has always used a boxing stance and attack that allowed him to be in better position to absorb punches if he was hit. Rather than Wlad who had never been hurt before... and used to put himself way out of position and extremely vulnerable to taking the sort of punches that put you down.... like the TOS fight for example. I don't care who you are. If you are standing on one foot as you are following through with a huge, missing right hand... you are going to get knocked off balance when hit in that position.

 

I have to agree with Widdow...Wlad's chin problem is very overstated.

Haye is in with less of a chance then most assume. TOS fight was a slip that happened to have a weak slap of a right hand cuff close too. The first Peter knockdown was straight up illegal(He did turn his head, but that doesnt mean you can slug him to the brainstem. Period.) The second kd no punch landed. The third was legit. Panell, balance. Brewster, all those shots and he never hit the floor.

Point is, his jaw isn't glass. Haye needs to fight, though. I do agree with that. Wlad is comfy in a boxing match, not really a brawl. Haye, I don't think is all that comfy in a rough fight either, but he'll be better off than Wlad. Haye needs to go on the attack, land big shots, and use his feet for once to avoid getting smothered, as his poor inside game will fail him against a fighter of Wlad's size and clinching acumen.

Really, I think Wlad should be ATLEAST a 3-1 fave. This is not a hard fight to call.