Do you think fighters, from the 90s onwards, are faster ?

and they were fighting in & around they're Natural Weight fluctuations.

 

Speed is nice to have, to have that extra gear (which Monzon worked in several gears, not all slow) but timing is so much more important. I would say, on average, the fighters of yesteryear had better timing, knew where the openings were and worried less on flashy shoeshining for the judges.

 

We also have to factor in certainly in championship fights, that since mid 80s fighters are boxing over the 12 rather 15 round distance, so pacing themselves is less of factor

 

Modern fighters are trained for explosiveness rather than constant motion of older eras. They look faster in short bursts but can't go at the same pace as fighters from older eras. Here's Barry McGuigan's opinion on this

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/boxi...n=continue_reading_button#amp-readmore-target

 

Well as overall quality declines and quality punching can and perhaps should be short and short is fast - no.

 

I would say it was because damage done was taken much more seriously.

 

Some are and some aren’t

 

Humans are evolving more rapidly nowadays, but it's not as significant as people think. For the most part, humans haven't really physically changed that much in the past few thousand years. They've gained a few Cm in the past 150 years but that's mainly it, although I think the next few decades might change that as the technology used to alter genetics is evolving rapidly.

But as of now, I don't think 90s-present humans are collectively fast enough to say they have a natural handspeed advantage. A good chunk of pre-80s fighters have faster hands than many modern ones.

 

Yes, and I think it is how they are trained and the incentive structure of the sport, with shorter fights, aesthetic scoring preferences of judges... I don't think there is something intrinsically different in the talent, at least below heavyweight.

 

I don't think, that modern boxers, on average, somehow have developed faster (or slower!) handspeed than the oldtimers. I don't see, how something like that would change from one generation to the next.

It's like asking, if today's fighters have stronger/weaker chins than back in the day - which of course is another thing, that can't be proven one way or the other.

 

These are excellent points and considerations imo. Timing, judgement of distance, variance in hand speed and pacing for the scheduled distance all come into play.

Personally, I also think Monzon’s hand speed was deceptive - even allowing for advantages in reach/height, he still got the punches home - he didn’t swing and miss a lot - and I don’t recall him ever missing badly. Watching Monzon hitting the heavy bag shows a hand speed that wasn’t entirely apparent in his actual fights.

It’s similar to people citing greater mobility in today’s fighters, as say, compared to someone like Joe Louis AS IF it’s an improvement by mere default. But the mobility has to be practical - jumping here and there means nothing if you’re still getting nailed. Louis’ economical mobility was more than sufficient.

Likewise hand speed - seen plenty of fighters who have fast hands but their connection rates aren’t necessarily notably better.

And finally, of course, there was Louis’ own hand speed - lightning fast but no powder puff shots or illusory shoe shining with fluff punches. Punching as hard, as fast and as accurately as Louis did still presents as highly extraordinary vision to this very day.

 

Johnson vs Flynn II. Year: 1912. 111 years ago.

I've time stamped this at 15;32, just prior to a Johnson launching and landing a multi punch combo barrage. This is laser fast punching Imo. The punching sequence will begin almost immediately after clicking on the link.

At a rough count, Johnson lands about 7-8 punches in the first unbroken salvo. He also lands some lighting fast shots after that. Flynn's head is clearly being belted this way and that - no powder puff shots. Old films often sell the old timers short - as it so happens, this particular clip does not. Obviously, you can slow it down to x .25 to confirm the punches thrown and landed for yourself.

For all his talent and boxing IQ otherwise, Johnson had extremely fast hands - perhaps underrated in terms of exactly how fast those hands were - and that speed definitely helped to give him a notable edge over the rest of the field.

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