Do you think Judo is somewhat a misused martial art in terms of MMA ??

That should be a bigger part of Judo and many other sports then it is. I think part of the problem is these guys are so athletic that they don't need to use feints and traps to win, but it would serve them very well if they did more of it. A lot of these guys just steam roll everone till one day they meet their match. Necessity is the mother of invention.

In Judo you are taught to get your opponent to push or pull and use that energy against them, a lot of guys don't learn to do that right.

 

Your statement was too general, hence me narrowing it down. I was agreeing with your sentiment that there are good reasons why judo doesn't show up much in MMA. Dip****.

 

You guys have tried this with guys not wearing anything you can grab onto? The key to the throws has to do with hips and balance and timing (just like most sport, actually) but it's a hell of a lot harder to get to that point against a guy you can't get a hold of. It's much easier to shoot for a leg in that case which is why most judo guys in mma end up using more wrestling moves than judo (see the Gamburian fight from last night).

 

We actually did some no gi training while I was there, and even with guys that'd normally toss me around like a rag doll all of a sudden we were a lot more evenly matched. That's when greco-roman syle clinch work comes into it, getting in tight and trying to secure underhooks. Still, their grip, balance and timing was phenomenal.

 

demian trained for years in judo

 

This is 100% what I've found. Judo is great for balance and "feeling" out momentum and such, but the actual throws are much harder and things like GR wrestling that train for no-gi situations are more practical.

 

Yep, in an mma match you really need to be something special to pull off and showcase the flashy judo moves with consistency. But a good judoka should come out on top or be very competitive with a greco wrestler in a lot of clinch situations. There are also sooo many variations, some of which may be legit mma techniques if someone just shows them or makes the changes to make them useful for mma. There are also a lot of moves that may not be recognized as judo, like inside leg sweep because other disciplines use it also. Sometimes it's hard to recognize but I think you are completely right about the more obvious eye catching judo throws that everyone loves to see.

 

I made this argument on another board once and got flamed for it, but it's silly to talk about figher X's "boxing" or fighter Y's "wrestling" when a) what their doing isn't boxing or wrestling, it's mma and b) the way that they learned to do what they're doing may not have every been boxing or wrestling. GSP has great takedowns and can control guys well on the ground, but he never wrestled in his life. To say that a guy like Matt Mitrione who has a great quick straight left hand is a good "boxer" when he only learned this stuff for mma makes no sense. Rory Macdonald is great at tons of thing but never learned them individually, just in the context of mma. What you're saying here is a perfect example. I forget the formal name for it, but the judo head throw gets called a "judo throw" in mma all the time when you find the same move in wrestling as well as any schoolyard in the world. It's a totally intuitive way to get someone down but somehow it gets called "judo" whether or not the guy doing it has ever meet a judoka. Referring to what the people are actually doing (takedowns from the clinch, takedowns from outside, punching etc) rather than mapping them onto some martial art/sport would make things a lot more honest and clear.

 

:good I think they've forgotten/gotten lazy/were never taught the principle behind it. It's like when they throw the Superman punch nowadays, there's not even a proper attempt to fake the low kick.

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My bad (falls back on noobiness)

 

Yeah, I grew up watching baseball and I remember Buck Martinez explaining pitching all the time and how important the change up was. And I applied it to the sports I played and did pretty well.

If you can learn that its real easy to play sports, but not to many people want to use tricks to win. They want to win with their physical gifts, even in Judo which is not suppose to be about that. Judo is suppose to mean the "gental way".

 

Yeah, watching some of these MMA guys fight to a standstill/stalemate against the cage was akin to watching my father try to bulldoze his way thru a child-proof pill bottleatsch

Having said that (& going back to Vic's original post), I've caught whatever little meagre offerings of Olympic judo my local station has offered up, and it looks like some of these guys are trying to 'force' their way too:-(

 

I was thinking about this the other day. Maybe I'm remembering things wrong, but it seems like Fedor always went for throws over shots.

 

Yeah I saw a vid with him talking about it at a practice and he was saying he doesn't like them because they tire you out moreso and even if they succeed you don't end in as an advantagous position as a throw.

He does have a point actually but it's a preference thing imo both have their uses.