Does Frazier get enough credit for beating Ali in FOTC?

Y donch U JUs FVK Orf?

 

No one disputes the verdict certainly not me.
As to the whipping, it was Frazier that went to the hospital, and the one whose fans say was ruined by the fight NOT ALI
Ali did not determine the timing of the fight that is a fallacy.
Show me a fighter without a big ego and I'll show you a loser.
Frazier would have stopped any other man in Ali's condition in the 11th rd, balls kept Ali upright , but hey don't give him any credit for that .

I watched the fight in 1971, a day after it happened, March the 9th to be precise, and I've seen it about 30 times since.

Frazier has ONE win over an ATG. ONE out of Five fights.

Want to check Ali's percentage?

 

Why can't you like both Ali and Frazier? They were both great men who put their lives and soles into those fights. I don't think Ali would think less of you if you gave Joe some credit, he himself has huge respect for Joe.

I do think Ali recovered better from that fight, I don't know what it was down to but Frazier fared worse overall out of winning. Maybe the exile and his excelent physical condition helped Ali?

Beating the top two contenders before TFOTC in better style than Frazier had in back to back fights (in less than a seven week period!) was excellent proof Ali was ready for Joe.

In fact Frazier had only fought 6 rounds in 21 months with Foster and Ellis.

 

I do like Frazier and as I have said he was a great fighter the night he beat Ali. I would also include the Thrilla as a great performance.What I'm not too keen on is some fan boys ,such as the one I responded to trying to BS me.

I disagree that Ali did not improve as he fought more I believe it is evident that he did.This shows me more ring rounds would have enhanced his performance,he did not trust his legs in the FOTC and gave away rounds resting there.

Don't tell me Frazier forced him into the ropes and corners ,he vouluntarily went there.If his legs had been 100% he would have been ring centre a lot more and not given those rounds away.imo Frazier fought 6 rds in the 21 months previous ? Ali fought 18rds in the previous 4 years!
To sum up Frazier was a great fighter that night he had an exciting ,all action style like a heavyweight Henry Armstrong.

I think he cheapened the title and his legacy a bit by defending against Daniels and Stander .
As a man I think Joe was terrific.

 

I understand what you are saying but I think TFOTC rounded off that era of heavyweights the 67-71' period and Frazier emphatically proved he was top dog. It's like Marciano when he beat Moore. Nobody else had established themselves. With that over and done with the 1972-73 stretch was left with an overlap of a yet unproven newer generation of contenders looking to prove themselves. Who was Frazier going to defend against without rematching somebody he already beat? Terrell or Patterson? What had Foreman, Bugner, Bodel,Norton and Lyle done in 1971-72 to sell any tickets against Frazier? By 73' Frazier did need to step up. He did but even the Daniels and Stander fights proved he had declined. He was wobbled by both. 67-71 was the Joe Frazier era.

 

I think Frazier needed to win that fight as bad as Joe Louis needed to beat Schmeling for his legacy.

 

You would have had to kill Joe Frazier on March 8, 1971 to beat him that night...Ali couldn't dictate the fight that night...something he wasn't accustomed to...hence the pitty pat punches...waving to the crowd...shaking his head every time Joe landed a good shot...Ali got his ass handed to him that night!!!

 

I would never knock Ali..he was magic...but the list of fighters he beat prior to facing Frazier were a moderate or old bunch.
Most had been mangled by Liston years earlier.
Frazier was the first guy Ali fought since Ali shot to prominence that was both unbeaten and younger than Ali.
Ali had 2 fights to warm up for Frazier and could have had more so no excuses.
On the night they were both peak or thereabouts and unbeaten
and Joe won fair and square.
He probably didnt get the credit due.
He was always overshadowed by Ali's persona.

 

bikoz sam1 go2 put d **** ur postin in d perspektiv it dizervs

 

I think he gets just the right amount .. I don't think Ali gets enough credit for taking on a prime Frazier when he himself was no where near ready to do so after such a long layoff and only two fights in three months .. the Quarry bout ended too fast due to a nasty cut to really test Ali who was slowing down by the round .. Ali looked absolutely terrible against Bonavena, a fact ultimately overlooked by many based on his shocking last round KO victory .. asll tis being said, for him to next take on Frazier and perform as well as he did and as brave as he did in many ways is his greatest performance .. little doubt in my mind that the exile, robbing Ali of peak years 26 - 28, took away the best heavyweight that ever lived .. he was something and the way he reinvented himself in career two with faded legs was heroic and amazing ..

 

Well said. For a big man like Ali to have been able to move as he did in the sixties was amazing and the Bonnavena and Frazier1 bouts showed up that point it looked like that part of him was gone. By the second Frazier match he was again able to be on his toes for much of the 12 rounds and it was a different scene against a slower Frazier. What some are leaving out here is a big part of what set Ali apart in his prime was the legs, just like for Louis it was his hand speed, etc. That all being said the Frazier of fotc would have been a fire for any of the greats.

 

Was this ali the same as the 60s version? please advise!!

 

Yes and no. Yes he was still good enough to duplicate all the results he produced in the 1960s. No because he was fighting a Prime fighter better than all the others he faced in the 1960s who was younger than he was.

He was as good, he just lost half a step and had not yet adapted to compensate.

 

Ali was never as good post exile as he was pre exile .. what made him the best was his speed and reflexes, neither of which came back 100 percent post exile .. he modified his style and was still a hell of a fighter but he was never the same.