Does jimmy wilde deserve to be amongst the top 25 boxers in history?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by lufcrazy, May 16, 2011.


  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I don't know.

    If you rank fighters based upon what they "could" have done in their own era, you're going to have about 25 fighters tied for first.
     
  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    what i mean is, i'm not sure he could literally have done any more than what he did do.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well for example he could have beaten Herman or Villa, likely the best fighters he ever met.

    And just how many title fights did he win?

    But like I said, who cares? I rank him based upon what he did do, not what he didn't. Maybe he would have benefited from sharing an era with Canto, Lopez and Humberto Gonzalez. Or maybe he would have been beaten. Based upon what he did do in his own time compared to what other fighters did in their own times he is not in my top 25.
     
  4. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    ok by what criteria do you have him as the greatest flyweight?
     
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I think he did more than any other flyweight whilst weighing in under the limit.
     
  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes.
     
  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I agree to an extent; I'm not sure Pong gets his due credit at the moment.

    I think beind classed as the greatest ever to grace a division is amongst the highest accolades one could ever achieve and in a division that old only 7 others could ever achieve it.

    obviously the history of the super's and light's is slightly diluted and not considered as important by some. but in nigh over 100 years noone is seen to have achieved more than wilde in that division. amazing stuff and i think you've convinced me he deserves a place in top 25 :good
     
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I'll give you an example. I have Dick Tiger ranked at #10 at MW. I have Burley ranked at #7. I have Williams ranked at #5. All these fighters beat better fighters than Wilde, and i'm quite satisfied of the fact. They also achieved good/great things outside of their own divisions.

    Now, Wilde's "achievement" of being arguably #1 in a top-light (though deep) division like fly is more impressive than the superior resumes of men ranked lower down in much more top heavy divisions, that's fine - your criteria are your own.

    But it's certainly not logic I could embrace or even take seriously when comparing fighters on a p4p ATG scale.
     
  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    The traditional divisions have the following at the top for me: louis, charles/moore, monzon, robinson, duran, pep, jofre, wilde.

    Obviously resume plays a huge part as does fighting outside of a comfortable weight. But I think considering the exclusivity of this "club" if you will I have to give it a huge weighting. An impressive resume is brilliant for the majority of cases, but being the greatest in a 100 year old division is surely an outstanding achievement.
     
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Like I say, i'd rather compare the fighters directly.

    Wilde falls well short compared to most of the men you list. Charles, Moore, Robinson and Pep for example are quite clearly in a completely different class in terms of greatness in-spite of them belonging to the same "club" in your view. To me, it's meaningless.

    But like I say, your criteria are your own.
     
  11. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    My list, I think, is as follows

    Fitzsimmons
    Langford
    Louis
    Robinson
    Armstrong
    Greb
    Ali
    Charles
    Pep
    Duran
    Walker
    B.leonard
    Burley
    Gans
    R. Leonard
    Whittaker
    Moore
    Holyfield
    Sanchez
    Rocky
    Monzon
    Hagler
    Arguello
    Jofre
    Wilde
     
  12. teeto

    teeto Obsessed with Boxing banned

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    exactly. Aaron Pryor must be one of the best to do it, he's nowhere near one of the greatest
     
  13. AlFrancis

    AlFrancis Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I agree with this 100%.
     
  14. Jorodz

    Jorodz watching Gatti Ward 1... Full Member

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    very interesting thread and quite informative. i wanted to say a certain "yes" to the question but i've seen some very solid arguments against that. keep going fellas
     
  15. kmac

    kmac On permanent vacation Full Member

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    i wouldn't put wilde in the top 25 but he was a great, great fighter.