Does Langford-Hague exist on film?

No Ive never uploaded fights to the internet (on youtube or whatever). I wouldnt want to take the time to compress them to that size (if thats what you have to do, I really dont know anything about uploading on youtube). I also personally dont like sites like youtube because the quality is so poor due to the compression. Its getting better but still not great. Furthermore, a lot of the rare stuff I find I still use as collateral for trades for equally rare stuff, thereby increasing my collection. If its on youtube it kills its value. Also, if I trade something that Im the only person who has it and tell that trading partner to keep it to himself (that I might keep his to myself) then go post that same film on youtube (my film) he would see that and say "ok, fair game, now I can trade it out." There goes its trading potential.

Now I have traded fights via sharing sites before, but thats a little different and while the stuff I traded was good stuff it wasnt what I could call rare and wasnt a part of any existing agreement I had with anyone to NOT trade it.

Heres an example. I recently made a nice find. Im the only person who has this film. I traded it to one guy who had a special interest in it for something only he had. Traded it to another guy who was also interested in it for something he had. And finally traded it to a third guy for some other nice rare films. So in addition to my original find, I got about four or five other films that only a few people have. Had I put that film on Youtube I would have never seen four or five fights that Ive always wanted to see that you can only read about in magazines. It sucks thats way it is but I didnt make this world, Im just living in it. If thats selfish then I guess Im selfish but its not by design (even this blowup with Clay started out of a generous act, I think even those who hate me can see that) and while in a perfect world Id love to post everything Ive got in full quality for free so everyone could view it and talk about it the first film I did that with would pretty much cap my ability to get or view anything else from a lot of people. Im not willing to do that because there are a lot more fights out there that I know exist that I dont have that I want to see.

In addition to all of my usual foraging for films I do some restoration work on boxing films. When I get these films from these guys the agreement is I fix them up and I get to keep my copy. This stuff as well is typically pretty rare. That would be really shitty if I used that position to get fights out of people and then sold or traded them. It would be kind of like a printing press taking your book to print and then instead publishing it under their own name.

 

I don't take credit for anything but sharing something once I became aware it existed and paying my IT guy a few bucks to upgrade it ... all you clowns that would hoard great pieces of rare footage from the others who love the game are small minded, nickel and dime jerk offs in my book. They should be shared so all can enjoy.

 

I've purchased fights from Raging_Bull. I don't recall him telling me not to re-trade them or put them up on Youtube. But, I just took it as an unspoken thing and it's not something I would do. Since then, some of these fights has shown up on Youtube. I still wouldn't post them at a later date. Klompton is talking about film which has much more value and he's talking of alliances and trusts he's made with other collectors and also the money, time, and work he put in to obtaining them. I can certainly see his point of view here.
I also think Youtube complicates things for these guys. You couldn't really sell copies to individuals because in short order they'd be up on youtube for free. The majority of us don't care about collecting film, we just want to see the fight, so a youtube version is sufficient. My only hope is that the collectors are responsible enough to take measures to insure these fights don't die when they die.
It would be really cool if someone would rent theatres, no video recording devices of any kind, and charge admission. Hire retired fighters as security to insure there are no bootleggers in the audience. I could see it now "put that cell phone away or im'a eat your children!!!".

 

I'm thrilled and appreciative of your efforts. But personally, I see Klompton's side too and can respect him keeping his word to someone about a film he probably obtained long before youtube.

 

I'm not singling Klompton out at all .. my feelings are broad based about all the hoarding claims ... in addition if someone goes on record saying they have such and such a clip to make a point in a holier than though manner and it is either extremely rare or never before seen then it's playing a game like children ... you have a golden nugget and don't want to share, keep it to yourself ... I think Clay did far more for the sport by writting his fine book than some clown hogging the footage ... the sport is dying as is and we don't a bunch of sadistic control freaks screwing around with clips ...

 

..... and I'm grateful that you took the time and effort to share it :good

 

See I find the above comment curious from you for a couple of reasons. Several years ago you completed a documentary film on Larry Holmes (which is excellent by the way) which had a lot of raw training footage etc. You spent quite a while trying to get the film picked up by networks or marketed. Why not just disperse that raw footage of Holmes with guys like Ali and Frazier for free? Why did you try so hard to sell your documentary when you could have just given it away? About eight years ago, before you had gotten the film on the market, you traded me for something (I cant remember what now) for a copy of that film (when it was still called "In The Arena") on condition that I not let it out of my possession. I still have it and have never let anyone else see it much less trade it out of my possession. Yet here you are criticising me for something that you asked of me and benefitted from. I find that curious.

 

You and Grant touch on a point. A very good point. Grant says that people who brag about having something rare and then wont let it out are like children playing a game. I agree. I get emails and PMs on this board (and this thread has increased them sadly) asking me what I have etc. I would be no different if I went out and bragged about my collection. In my opinion its better to keep it to myself what I have and what I dont have so people dont then get angry that Im dangling it in front of them. Im not. Nobody knows whats in my collection but me and thats the way it will stay as long as things stay the way they are. Its nothing against any fans its just that I dont want people thinking Im holding this stuff up and going "nah nah nah nah". Thats why I say anyone who wants to come and sit and watch films with me is welcome. Id love to shoot the **** with someone about the stuff that Ive seen and their reactions. Thats the frustrating part.

Now I could write my reactions or fight reports on these fights BUT to me thats not really a lot different than bragging that youve got something and then not letting anyone see it. The only reason I posted that still from my copy of Langford-Jeanette was because when I talk about boxing films, and my knowledge of what is and isnt out there its not because Im talking out of my ass. Its because in addition to my full time job I do this several hours a day. I dont sit around and trade DVDs (although I do that too on very rare occasion) Im working my ass off on finding the rarest of the rare. Anyone who knows my research on Greb, or now my work on film knows I pour everything into it and make sure I work twice as hard as the next guy so I can find what he couldnt. I posted it to show I know what Im talking about and not just blowing smoke. I posted that pic so people here know to seperate me from the jokers who make outlandish claims about films they "know" are in someone elses possession. Until then I could just be another person making ridiculous claims from behind a computer screen, although there are a few here who know that isnt true and know Im not bragging when say whats posted above.

 

Wow. Thank you very much for the opportunity. I will most certainly take you up on that when I come home for easter break in April.

 

Its easy to be uptight about it. Think about it. On the one hand youve got a lot of guys you like who want something you have. On the other hand you have a lot of other guys you like who can continue to provide you with those things but wont if you blow their trust. How much do you say without pissing off one or the other side? If you dont say enough you risk looking like you dont know what your talking about. If you say too much you risk pissing off the ones who have what you want, or the ones who want what you have simply because they cant have it? I could stop posting about films entirely which would probably solve my frustration but when its something you love...

As for how we find each other. Well. I dont know. Im kind of like a sponge with all of this stuff. I might have read a snippet from a magazine article twenty years ago about how someone filmed this, or has that film or whatever. Then I kind of work back from there. Sometimes it leads somewhere and sometimes it doesnt. Sometimes you get lucky and just meet people. Sometimes they approach you. Networking, etc. It doesnt happen over night. Ive been doing this for years but the last 10 years or so is what really got me into collecting the rare films and thats an offshoot of my research into Greb and trying to find a film on him (which I am still doing and which I have been unsuccessful). Its kind of funny because the one thing I want and have searched so hard for I cant find but along the way its like Ive picked up all of these breadcrumbs of rare fights and fighters from all over. Sometimes I marvel at some of the footage that I found while NOT being able to find Greb footage. Talk about frustrating.

 

Sounds good.

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