Does Lennox Lewis not fighting Bowe the second best HW from his era ruin his legacy?

Trashing and not defending are not the same. I've seen simply impossible situations arise with multiple titles, such as one belt organization saying you have to fight fighter A next to keep your belt and other organization saying you have to fight fighter B next to keep your belt. Obviously it's impossible to do both if they are different fighters.

Wlad never really had that problem because his brother held one of the belts.

 

This.

When you also consider that Lewis is lacking a win against a prime ATG on his resume (which there were a few fighting in his era) and that he was brutally stopped by journeyman twice in his reign..... his legacy doesn't seem that great to begin with.

He is probably the most overrated fighter on this board.

 

You must have a very low opinion of Vitali because I think that was a win over a prime near ATG, but I guess you don't like the guy.

But you can say that about almost all heavyweight fighters.

Who's Liston's ATG victory over? Dempsey's? Wlad's? Holmes? Tyson's? the list goes on and on... Johnson?, Louis? Marciano?

 

Do you know who you can't say that about??.....Bowe:thumbsup

 

Actually you can, because it's circular reasoning to say Bowe beat and ATG in Holyfield and Holyfield beat an ATG in Bowe. If neither beat any other ATG's because it was their victories and defeats that put these labels on these guys, especially Bowe, who really had nothing in his career but those two wins.

So if you eliminate their trilogy who does Bowe have left?

 

Zak is that you? lol

 

Ok. Now you're just being ridiculous. You don't get to take away either man's win just to try to boost the weak resume of your hero.

 

I guess you don't know what circular reasoning means..perhaps you should google it. Bowe can't be great if his only achievement is beating Holyfield AND if Holyfield is only considered great because he beat Bowe.

That, my friend, is the definition of circular reasoning. That is absolutely no different than saying Rahman's an ATG because he beat Lewis. If not, tell me how it's in any way different?

Here's the definition, of what circular reasoning is:


Description: A type of reasoning in which the proposition is supported by the premises, which is supported by the proposition, creating a circle in reasoning where no useful information is being shared. This fallacy is often quite humorous.


Logical Form:
X is true because of Y.
Y is true because of X.

 

Who ever said that Holyfield is only considered great because he beat Bowe? Is that your stance?

No, I don't need to google circular reasoning, because it's a tool for fools, my friend.

All evil men have red blood. Lennox Lewis has red blood. Therefore Lennox Lewis is evil. See how stupid that is.

 

2 very different situations.

Lewis/Bowe was the biggest fight possible at the time the fight it was worth a guaranteed $46 million. No other opponent would earn Bowe as much in one fight. If Lewis had agreed to the 75/25 split, Bowe would have received an incredible $34 million which is insane money, it would have been the biggest single purse in boxing history back then and even now that would be the 2nd highest guaranteed purse ever at heavyweight after the $35 million Holyfield got for Holyfield/Tyson II.

When Lewis relinquished his IBF belt in 2002 to fight Tyson instead of Byrd nobody wanted to see Lewis/Byrd. Even Byrd's promoter at the time Don King didn't want the fight. He paid Lewis $1 million to drop the belt to allow a Holyfield/Byrd fight. Lewis went onto be paid a guaranteed $17.5 million against Tyson. Byrd made a mere $2.15 million to face Holyfield who made $5 million.

When Lewis was stripped of the WBA title in 2000 he had 2 mandatory opponents he had to face. Grant was his WBC mandatory and Ruiz was his WBA mandatory. Lewis got dispensation from the WBA to face his WBC mandatory Grant first.

The reason Lewis was stripped was due to a contract technicality which King used to get a court order to force Lewis to face his WBA mandatory before anyone else. The WBA didn't even want to strip Lewis, it was King which forced the WBA to strip Lewis.

Lewis could either be stripped or cancel his fight with Grant, which was only 2 weeks away and fight the then unknown Ruiz for peanuts and that's if he could even come to terms with King for a Ruiz fight. King may have very well just strung negotiations along until Lewis gave up the belt, look how long it took for Stiverne/Wilder to be signed. Lewis chose to not throw away the work he had put into preparing and promoting the Grant fight where he was paid $7.5 million which was more than the combined purses of Holyfield and Ruiz when they fought for the vacant title.

 

Bowe got his shot at Holyfield by being bumped ahead of Ruddock in the pecking order and signing a deal which stated he would defend against the winner of Lewis/Ruddock.

Ruiz wasn't even in the picture when Lewis signed to fight Grant, the WBA didn't have a #1 ranked fighter after Akinwande caught hepititis and agreed to let Lewis fight Grant first, King took Lewis to court to get him stripped.

Lewis never signed to fight Byrd and was after more lucrative fights against Tyson and the Klitschkos when Byrd was #1 ranked for the IBF. Byrd's own promoter paid Lewis to drop the title.

It's not the same. Bowe backed out of a deal that was signed, Lewis never signed to fight in the first place.

 

Well then what ATG prime fighter did Holyfield beat, if Bowe's excluded?

And if you want to label Bowe an ATG for beating Holyfield, and only Holyfield, then what wouldn't the same label apply to Rahman?

 

Are you dense?

I never labeled Bowe and ATG for beating Holyfield.

I said that Bowe has a win over a prime ATG, Holyfield.

Lennox Lewis does not hold a win over a prime ATG.

Bowe's best win>>>>Lewis' best win.

Should I draw you pictures or something?

 

Bowe best wins = Holyfield x2 (one's a hepatitis version)

Lewis's best wins = Ruddock, Golota, Tua Vitali,
Holyfield x 2 (older version)

 

Exactly. Now we are in agreement.

Bowe's best win>>>>Lewis' best win