Does Michael Moorer get the respect he deserves in classic matchup debates?

Moorer wasnt very good at heavyweight, interesting character, he was at his best in Holyfield I (when Holy had some heart flutter/EPO hiccup etc) but not as great a boxer as some make him out. Not a big puncher, very bad chin for a title challenger, he wasnt as good a pure boxer as Holyfield and behind in every other category as well.

Interesting boxer but he did well to catch Holyfield on a bad day. I felt bad for him in the re-match, Holyfield was magnificent but I wanted Moorer to at least go 12 close rounds.

Pretty much everyone whos held a major belt since beats him, might be one or two exceptions but Ruiz and co would deal with him IMO, Moorer's boxing ability is fair but not exceptional IMO and everyone knows about his chin.

 

Pound for pound he's really good, but as a heavyweight champion, i don't rate him high at all. And i don't think that's unfair. He is the only top heavyweight who got knocked out by grandpa Foreman in a 10-year span. He did beat Holyfield, but by a very close margin and Evander was in terrible form. An older but better conditioned Holyfield knocked him down five times or something, en route to a TKO win. The fight with Cooper could've gone both ways. Many will point to Holyfield-Cooper, but the important difference here is that Holyfield got caught ONCE and nearly got stopped, but was in full control otherwise. Moorer was in continuous danger of being stopped and never really looked convincing. Fought stupid in laying on the ropes. Botha and Schulz were good wins but nothing more. The Tua fight basically shows what was apparant during his entire career: he can't take a heavyweight punch.

 

I'd favour Moorer over some smaller heavyweights though, or at least pick him to cause them some problems.

How do people feel he'd match up with the following fighters:

Marciano (Marciano would take him out but I think Moorer would have his moments)
Jack Johnson (or would Johnson maul him in close and stop him late?)
Ingemar Johannson (but Ingos right would be a perfect shot to land through Moorers combos)

Anyone think he'd cause any of the above some problems?

 

I have to disagree. Cooper nearly stopped him. Holyfield had him down six times and stopped him. Foreman, who never stopped anyone of note during his entire 10-year comeback (including many soft touches and the weak-jawed Morrison), but knocked Moorer out badly. Tua knocked him out cold. Sure, he was old by that time, but Tua wasn't at his best either... the most important thing is that he was got knocked out bad, in just 30 or so seconds. Being old most of the time doesn't mean you can't take a shot anymore, it means you can't stop the punches from landing. And in Moorer's case, just like Norton's, that translates to a first round KO defeat.

For instance, guys like Louis, Tyson, Ali, Jeffries, etc, all lost when they were far past their primes, but none of them suffered first round KO losses just because they were old.

 

actually, how do people think Norton vs Moorer would go?

 

When Michael Moorer came along the only comparison was of a southpaw Bob Foster. I remember thinking the lightheavies were about to enter another golden era.

Forget about the all-time matchups. Moorer barely fought anyone from his own time. Someone help me out and remind me of a few details from Moorer-Andries? How about Moorer-Hill? Moorer-Williams? Moorer-Harding? His entire "reign" at 175 consists of his win over former titleholder Leslie Stewart.

Let's move on to heavy. Somebody must remember his fight with Tyson? Lewis? Bowe? Mercer? He has one truly significant win via his decision over Holy. Measure that against thier rematch and his defeat at the hands of Foreman. By my read that's 1-2.

What else is there to look at? His war with Cooper? His kayoes of Alex Stewart and Botha? His boring decisions over Bonecrusher, Schultz and Bean?

 

I'm not maintaining that the man's chin was made of stone. I just think the claims about it being constructed of "glass" are a bit overstated. There are worse things than being stopped or floored by Holyfield, Foreman, Tua and Cooper, especially if three of those are your only stoppage losses in nearly 60 fights.. He also took a fair number of shots from those guys and others.. Did Moorer have some durability problems? Yes, absolutely.. But is it fair to oversimply the issue by saying that he couldn't take a punch, period? I don't think so..

I'd also like to point out that you seemed to make a big issue out of the first round KO loss to Tua, as though it was the major hallmark of a weak chin.. I'll remind you that John Ruiz was KO'd by Tua in even less time than Moorer was, and nobody ever accuses the guy of being "chinny".

 

How do you know if someone had durabilty problems when he barely fought anyone? How many more stoppage losses would he have if he had fought Harding, Williams and Andries at 175. These are guys who proved what they were made of one way or the other.

Lemmy ask it again. How many more stoppage losses would he have if he had fought Tyson, Bowe & Lewis?

 

I'm only going to provide these two answers.

1. I never said the man had a chin made of stone

2. I think people go too far in the other direction when they say his chin is pure glass.

 

Good job ducking my questions....

How many more stoppage losses would he have if he had fought Harding, Williams and Andries at 175? How many more stoppage losses would he have if he had fought Tyson, Bowe & Lewis?

 

I'm not ducking anything... I just don't want to spend all morning debating a moot point.. He never fought those guys, so we'll never know... I prefer to rate the man's chin on what we DO KNOW..Moorer was a light heavyweight who jumped up to heavy during a time when there were a lot of big men with big punches, and yet was only stopped 3 times in nearly 60 fights.. He also won some fights against guys who could crack after taking their best shots... After all that, if you still want to argue that the man had a glass jaw, then there's nothing that I can say that's going to change that.. Never mind what he would have done against prince Charles or Jeff Harding...

 

Moorer was far from a glassjaw at 175. In fact he usually took some punishment before getting started. Not that his chin wasn't dentable, Frankie Swindell shook him up, but I can't see him being stopped by anything less than a big puncher at light heavyweight.

 

Agreed,

Mario Melo was also a guy who could crack, though most people don't even know who he is.

 

You not only duck the question, but now you lie too? I don't know that the man had a glass jaw, that is the "moot point" because he barely fought anyone.

A lot of big men with big punches? Lemmy help you out here. It's called called the heavyweight division for a reason. They are ALL big men.

If you don't think that a 175 lb matchup between Moorer and Williams or Harding or Andries or Hill would have been significant, I think you're in a very small minority.

This thread is about Moorer and classic matchups. "Never mind how he would have done"? I am talking about what he could have done. I am talking about possible classic matchups that should have happened.