Dreamfight - Jack Dempsey (September 14,1923) vs. Rocky Marciano (September 23,1952)

Styles make fights and Marciano will probably win by late stoppage.

 

I'm talking prime Dempsey, he was not prime against Tunney. His legs weren't what they used to be, same for his hand speed, reflexes and timing. In his prime he could go 10 hard rounds without trouble and went the 15 round distance against Tommy Gibbons without fading noticably. As for him being the better finisher, I think it comes down to Dempsey's mentality. He wanted the knock-out, he wanted to get his opponent out of there as fast as he could, so he was always going to go into overdrive when he had his man hurt. Marciano was an excellent finisher as well, but watching Dempsey on film jumping on and tearing away at guys like Willard, Firpo or Carpenteir it's plain to see how badly Dempsey wanted to get them knocked out IMO.

 

Hmm, don't agree with Dempsey having a better chin than Marciano.

Don't see Marciano being dropped by Tunney. Tunney wasn't quite the puncher Archie and Walcott were, in my opinion.

 

I agree that Dempsey was somewhat past his prime against Tunney (maybe that had to do with his lack of activity while champion...?). What makes acknowledging him as a better finisher than Marciano hard is that Willard, Firpo, and Carpenteir were not as good as Walcott, Moore, and Charles.

The Willard win in particular is not very impressive to me. In my eyes it's more of an indicator of the necesity for a sane referee and the neutral corner rule than an indicator of Dempsey's prowess. The Willard Dempsey fought was an old, inactive version of one of the weakest champions in heavyweight history, and certainly of the modern gloved era.

 

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Dempsey was all but shot against Tunney, and I have no doubt it was due to his years at a time lay offs that he was taking throughout his championship. He was a bit sharper in their second fight, but not even close to as good as he was in 1918-1923. One thing that I find frustrating is when people try to deprecate Dempsey's victory over Willard by saying he just “beat one of the worst champions in heavyweight history”, and when you look at that on paper, it's not that impressive, but when you watch in on film you realize he didn't just beat Willard, he annihilated a heavyweight champion with a cast iron jaw and a deadly punch who outweighed Dempsey by close to 60 pounds and was 5 inches taller. It was one of the most savage beatings in boxing history, total and complete domination the likes of which is rarely ever seen. As for the whole “Who’s a better finisher” argument, there’s no way to come to a satisfactory conclusion on that one.[/FONT]
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Rocky wins in a brutal slugfest

 

One thing I find frustrating is Dempsey taking 3 or so YEARS off as champ. If he was rusty in his next fight... well that's a big surprise I think him taking a few years off had more to do with Firpo scrambling his brains than anything else. Mr. "Intimidation" was worried about nearly every respectable HW boxer after the tomato can Firpo... so much for Jack "the HW" Dempsey! A top 20 is too much for him.

 

Sweet Jesus, would you people change the ****ing record. Every time Dempsey's brought up it's the same **** over and over.

 

Sorry, Lord, the facts are just too hard to change

 

The problem is that we can't have a discussion about Dempsey without people like you chiming in with your "facts". How does his inactivity as a champion or his failure to fight Wills factor into head to head ability? We know he was an inactive champion, we know he never fought Wills. You don't need to point it out at every opportunity. All it does is lead to pointless arguments that are never fully resolved.

 

No, what it really does is point out some possible flaws to those who like Dempsey, nothing more. The guy was hardly without flaws... to say the least!

 

Every fighter has some flaws, why some of the people in this board make it their personal mission to point out all of Dempsey's every time he's brought up is beyond me.

 

Dempsey is bad for Marciano if you ask me. There's nothing keeping Marciano away from Dempsey's faster hands and explosiveness. I don't care how good his chin is if he's coming straight at Dempsey he's getting stopped.